4 ms·

My parents taught me that debt was bad. They told me that credit cards were traps to get you into debt, that preyed on poor impulse control, and that it was bet

My parents taught me that debt was bad. They told me that credit cards were traps to get you into debt, that preyed on poor impulse control, and that it was better not to have one. If you can't tell, my parents grew up in a time when the credit score system didn't really matter, and didn't understand it. I did not get a credit card. I did not have any loans, for school or anything else. My credit score wasn't even a number, it just didn't exist. Even the bank I banked with, which could see that I had more than $8k USD deposited monthly, that could see I had $30k in an account with them, would not give me a loan to buy a car. Even if I were to get a credit card and pay it back on time, my credit score would be quite low due to having no history, and I still could not get a loan. I'm fortunate that the apartments I have rented so far have not done credit checks, only background checks and looked at salaries / offer letters, but there are many apartments I simply could not rent since I would obviously fail their credit check, despite never having had any debt.

gruez 4y ago
>My credit score wasn't even a number, it just didn't exist. Even the bank I banked with, which could see that I had more than $8k USD deposited monthly, that could see I had $30k in an account with them, would not give me a loan to buy a car. Right, because it's a credit score, not a finance score. I'm not sure what you want here. Do you want credit bureaus to collect even more information about your financial life so they can have a more accurate picture?
- wmf 4y ago
  I see this as an education problem. People need to be taught the specific rules of credit scores in addition to general personal finance.
  - TheDong 4y ago
    I feel like my parent's point about credit cards and college loans being bad were correct though. Like, I believe they're right that going to college on a full-ride scholarship was better than going to a more expensive one on a loan. I also believe they're right that credit cards are bad. Like, banks make money on credit cards by: 1. hoping you miss a payment, and collecting interest, and 2. charging merchants, thus raising the price of goods for everyone (typically) I guess you're saying that we should teach people "Yes, use credit cards, these tools designed to put you in debt, but be careful. Why use something designed to put you in debt? Because there's another private company that will punish you by not letting you rent certain apartments if you don't use a credit card"
    - cudgy 4y ago
      I wish I had parents like yours. Overall, credit is not advantageous to most people that use it for consumerism. Credit should only be used for investments with a commensurate return above the interest rate.
      - NickC25 4y ago
        100% this. My parents were quite well off, and my dad often times tried to get me to use a credit card, not because it was free money (i was very well financially educated by them) but because things like credit scores do get checked by employers (sometimes) or housing companies to determine all sorts of things, so it would make sense to buy 1-2 small things (say, like a pack of gum or a sandwich) a month on the card to immediately pay it off, so the credit score would be good. I protested, and to this day have never owned a credit card. I live within my means, don't splurge on stupid shit, and do money-saving things as much as I can. I don't own a car, and since I'm fortunate to live in a dense city in a warm environment, I can walk almost anywhere at any time of year. There's also free public transportation. The only "credit" I have is a small amount of margin I have in my trading account, which I only use on topping up low-risk, dividend-paying investments that I also sell deep OTM calls against. It's a slight risk, yes, but it's as delta-neutral as I can get while still making consistent money.
- TheDong 4y ago
  > Do you want credit bureaus to collect even more information about your financial life so they can have a more accurate picture? I mean, if instead it was the government, and they could also draw information about my salary, yeah, that sounds kinda nice. Not having to own a credit card to prove that I exist to a landlord does seems pretty good to me. But my overall point here is that a credit score is not as simple as the above poster made it sound. Someone who's been financially responsible can still run into issues because of this weird system leaking into so many places.
- DSMan195276 4y ago
  > Right, because it's a credit score, not a finance score. I'm not sure what you want here. Do you want credit bureaus to collect even more information about your financial life so they can have a more accurate picture? To some extent _yes_, if that's how this has to work. If my ability to make significant life steps is based entirely on their view of my ability to pay debts then I would rather they at least have the full picture. As it is it's extremely inconsistent, one place I rented reported my rent payments to some of the credit bureaus (but not all of them), the others did not. Additionally utility bills don't appear, despite them probably being a reasonable gauge of whether you can pay for stuff on time (at least as reasonable as everything else they use). It is what it is, but I was in that poster's same position and agree with them that it feels like a very dumb situation. I'm lucky that I at least saw it coming and a few years before buying a house I opened a credit card with the only purpose being to build my credit history. I have one thing that charges about ~$8 a month to it and it gets auto paid, and apparently _that_ was a big key to determining whether I'll be able to manage paying for a house. IMO that's just silly.
mixmastamyk 4y ago
Same here, but it has not been a problem with good job and finances. Buying a car or renting apartments.

gruez 4y ago

>My credit score wasn't even a number, it just didn't exist. Even the bank I banked with, which could see that I had more than $8k USD deposited monthly, that could see I had $30k in an account with them, would not give me a loan to buy a car. Right, because it's a credit score, not a finance score. I'm not sure what you want here. Do you want credit bureaus to collect even more information about your financial life so they can have a more accurate picture?

wmf 4y ago
I see this as an education problem. People need to be taught the specific rules of credit scores in addition to general personal finance.
- TheDong 4y ago
  I feel like my parent's point about credit cards and college loans being bad were correct though. Like, I believe they're right that going to college on a full-ride scholarship was better than going to a more expensive one on a loan. I also believe they're right that credit cards are bad. Like, banks make money on credit cards by: 1. hoping you miss a payment, and collecting interest, and 2. charging merchants, thus raising the price of goods for everyone (typically) I guess you're saying that we should teach people "Yes, use credit cards, these tools designed to put you in debt, but be careful. Why use something designed to put you in debt? Because there's another private company that will punish you by not letting you rent certain apartments if you don't use a credit card"
  - cudgy 4y ago
    I wish I had parents like yours. Overall, credit is not advantageous to most people that use it for consumerism. Credit should only be used for investments with a commensurate return above the interest rate.
    - NickC25 4y ago
      100% this. My parents were quite well off, and my dad often times tried to get me to use a credit card, not because it was free money (i was very well financially educated by them) but because things like credit scores do get checked by employers (sometimes) or housing companies to determine all sorts of things, so it would make sense to buy 1-2 small things (say, like a pack of gum or a sandwich) a month on the card to immediately pay it off, so the credit score would be good. I protested, and to this day have never owned a credit card. I live within my means, don't splurge on stupid shit, and do money-saving things as much as I can. I don't own a car, and since I'm fortunate to live in a dense city in a warm environment, I can walk almost anywhere at any time of year. There's also free public transportation. The only "credit" I have is a small amount of margin I have in my trading account, which I only use on topping up low-risk, dividend-paying investments that I also sell deep OTM calls against. It's a slight risk, yes, but it's as delta-neutral as I can get while still making consistent money.
TheDong 4y ago
> Do you want credit bureaus to collect even more information about your financial life so they can have a more accurate picture? I mean, if instead it was the government, and they could also draw information about my salary, yeah, that sounds kinda nice. Not having to own a credit card to prove that I exist to a landlord does seems pretty good to me. But my overall point here is that a credit score is not as simple as the above poster made it sound. Someone who's been financially responsible can still run into issues because of this weird system leaking into so many places.
DSMan195276 4y ago
> Right, because it's a credit score, not a finance score. I'm not sure what you want here. Do you want credit bureaus to collect even more information about your financial life so they can have a more accurate picture? To some extent _yes_, if that's how this has to work. If my ability to make significant life steps is based entirely on their view of my ability to pay debts then I would rather they at least have the full picture. As it is it's extremely inconsistent, one place I rented reported my rent payments to some of the credit bureaus (but not all of them), the others did not. Additionally utility bills don't appear, despite them probably being a reasonable gauge of whether you can pay for stuff on time (at least as reasonable as everything else they use). It is what it is, but I was in that poster's same position and agree with them that it feels like a very dumb situation. I'm lucky that I at least saw it coming and a few years before buying a house I opened a credit card with the only purpose being to build my credit history. I have one thing that charges about ~$8 a month to it and it gets auto paid, and apparently _that_ was a big key to determining whether I'll be able to manage paying for a house. IMO that's just silly.

mixmastamyk 4y ago

Same here, but it has not been a problem with good job and finances. Buying a car or renting apartments.