5 ms·

The flippant attitude that people have towards map-reading today is appalling. Maybe its the eagle scout in me but how can someone NOT want to learn to read a m

The flippant attitude that people have towards map-reading today is appalling. Maybe its the eagle scout in me but how can someone NOT want to learn to read a map? It isn't even that hard! What happens if your device fails you?

Shared404 4y ago
+1. Not an Eagle Scout, and have mixed feeling on scouting as an org at this point, but I'm very grateful to have learned how to read maps properly.
dudul 4y ago
I've always been a bit surprised by the sentence "learn to read a map". What is there to learn exactly?
- ryanianian 4y ago
  Looking at a map and doing basic a->b route planning is straightforward. Doing it well is a skill. Finding yourself when you don't know where you are and have limited landmark info, and using the cartographically-significant features of the map to plan a route that avoids hazards or navigates with tolls, highways, and rest-stops in mind are very much a skill that needs to be practiced even if the MO is simple at first.
  - dudul 4y ago
    I feel like we're diverging towards trip planning here more than just reading a map. That, sure i can see how experience can make a difference.
- fooker 4y ago
  Given a map, can you find where you are in the map without GPS? How about planning a route from contour plots? Or maybe figure out which direction you should go without a digital compass?
  - dudul 4y ago
    Yes to all. The map is a projection of your surroundings. You just need to "map" what you see to the map to be able to see where you are and where north is. I guess contour plots is a tad more advanced since it's trying to represent the z axis on a flat sheet of paper. I'm not trying to be obtuse, I genuinely don't see how it is difficult to read a map.
    - fooker 4y ago
      > You just need to "map" what you see to the map to be able to see where you are and where north is. Well, you have provided a neat definition of map reading. :)
      - dudul 4y ago
        I know lol that's why I'm not sure how it is difficult or something to learn really. I guess your mention of representation of elevation made me realize that you at least need to learn the conventions and the key to a map.
        fooker 4y ago
        >I know lol that's why I'm not sure how it is difficult or something to learn really. Imagine how easy recursion is to grok for most of us and absurdly painful for most people trying to learn programming.
  - bearmode 4y ago
    Yes, yes, and yes. All basic skills any hiker should have.
rcthompson 4y ago
Back before ubiquitous smart phones, I had a (now ex) partner who I discovered couldn't read a map to save their life. I printed out the Google maps route to the nearest Target (we had just moved to a new city) and was surprised when they couldn't give me directions based on the map because I didn't also print out the turn by turn directions (which I considered a redundant waste of paper). I think that incident was what made me realize that map reading was a skill that actually needed to be learned.
lubujackson 4y ago
It is incredible how much of the human mind is centered around orientation and direction. It makes sense from an evolutuonary perspective, but there have been studies about how quickly the skill atrophies without use. I believe it is a valuable skill to maintain or develop. Kids most obviously develop it now through games like Minecraft, but I wouldn't be surprised if there is a correlation between navigational skills and general memory ability.
aliqot 4y ago
Don't even get me started on the compass :/ the coddling that our technological advances provide are erasing entire swaths of generation intellectual wealth.
ryanianian 4y ago
I'm also an eagle scout. Taught the orienteering merit badge for years. But secret: I have the absolute WORST sense of direction. I have no internal sense of orientation or distance. Seriously I get lost if I turn left out of the corner store instead of right. I can read a map with a compass and straight-edge and find where I am based on triangulation. But once I actually have to make realtime decisions using little more than a map I get anxious and frustrated, I usually just give up and look for landmarks or one-way streets that I can find and follow. Or hope that my phone's terrible compass and navigation-hostile map programs work. (Can we talk about map apps not even showing street names or one-way directions without having to pan and zoom all over the map?) Even if you know how to read a map, they're just not a very good UX for finding where you are and making minor course-corrections in realtime.
- MisterBastahrd 4y ago
  Even before mapquest was a thing, I was recording directions from paper maps as if it was. Sure, I'd have a map open if I were driving in an area I was unfamiliar with, but I'd also write a list of roads and exits. The only real major advantage that gps systems have over the list method is that they can tell you when you're near an exit. Back in the early 00s I was driving to New Orleans from Dallas on a particularly foggy night and I missed the same exit 3 times because I could barely make out the exit signs.
Pxtl 4y ago
Funny story - I was at Disney for new year's, and Disney parks have an impressive mapping app, but phones aren't great at detecting your heading when you're not at driving speed and the walking directions mode was awful. As a result, it was basically a dumb map with lots of excellent live data on it and a "you are here" dot. A lot of people were having trouble with it because we're all used to "turn left here" instead of the top-view get-your-bearings go-that-way approach to a map.

Shared404 4y ago

+1. Not an Eagle Scout, and have mixed feeling on scouting as an org at this point, but I'm very grateful to have learned how to read maps properly.

dudul 4y ago

I've always been a bit surprised by the sentence "learn to read a map". What is there to learn exactly?

ryanianian 4y ago
Looking at a map and doing basic a->b route planning is straightforward. Doing it well is a skill. Finding yourself when you don't know where you are and have limited landmark info, and using the cartographically-significant features of the map to plan a route that avoids hazards or navigates with tolls, highways, and rest-stops in mind are very much a skill that needs to be practiced even if the MO is simple at first.
- dudul 4y ago
  I feel like we're diverging towards trip planning here more than just reading a map. That, sure i can see how experience can make a difference.
fooker 4y ago
Given a map, can you find where you are in the map without GPS? How about planning a route from contour plots? Or maybe figure out which direction you should go without a digital compass?
- dudul 4y ago
  Yes to all. The map is a projection of your surroundings. You just need to "map" what you see to the map to be able to see where you are and where north is. I guess contour plots is a tad more advanced since it's trying to represent the z axis on a flat sheet of paper. I'm not trying to be obtuse, I genuinely don't see how it is difficult to read a map.
  - fooker 4y ago
    > You just need to "map" what you see to the map to be able to see where you are and where north is. Well, you have provided a neat definition of map reading. :)
    - dudul 4y ago
      I know lol that's why I'm not sure how it is difficult or something to learn really. I guess your mention of representation of elevation made me realize that you at least need to learn the conventions and the key to a map.
      - fooker 4y ago
        >I know lol that's why I'm not sure how it is difficult or something to learn really. Imagine how easy recursion is to grok for most of us and absurdly painful for most people trying to learn programming.
- bearmode 4y ago
  Yes, yes, and yes. All basic skills any hiker should have.

rcthompson 4y ago

Back before ubiquitous smart phones, I had a (now ex) partner who I discovered couldn't read a map to save their life. I printed out the Google maps route to the nearest Target (we had just moved to a new city) and was surprised when they couldn't give me directions based on the map because I didn't also print out the turn by turn directions (which I considered a redundant waste of paper). I think that incident was what made me realize that map reading was a skill that actually needed to be learned.

lubujackson 4y ago

It is incredible how much of the human mind is centered around orientation and direction. It makes sense from an evolutuonary perspective, but there have been studies about how quickly the skill atrophies without use. I believe it is a valuable skill to maintain or develop. Kids most obviously develop it now through games like Minecraft, but I wouldn't be surprised if there is a correlation between navigational skills and general memory ability.

aliqot 4y ago

Don't even get me started on the compass :/ the coddling that our technological advances provide are erasing entire swaths of generation intellectual wealth.

ryanianian 4y ago

I'm also an eagle scout. Taught the orienteering merit badge for years. But secret: I have the absolute WORST sense of direction. I have no internal sense of orientation or distance. Seriously I get lost if I turn left out of the corner store instead of right. I can read a map with a compass and straight-edge and find where I am based on triangulation. But once I actually have to make realtime decisions using little more than a map I get anxious and frustrated, I usually just give up and look for landmarks or one-way streets that I can find and follow. Or hope that my phone's terrible compass and navigation-hostile map programs work. (Can we talk about map apps not even showing street names or one-way directions without having to pan and zoom all over the map?) Even if you know how to read a map, they're just not a very good UX for finding where you are and making minor course-corrections in realtime.

MisterBastahrd 4y ago
Even before mapquest was a thing, I was recording directions from paper maps as if it was. Sure, I'd have a map open if I were driving in an area I was unfamiliar with, but I'd also write a list of roads and exits. The only real major advantage that gps systems have over the list method is that they can tell you when you're near an exit. Back in the early 00s I was driving to New Orleans from Dallas on a particularly foggy night and I missed the same exit 3 times because I could barely make out the exit signs.

Pxtl 4y ago

Funny story - I was at Disney for new year's, and Disney parks have an impressive mapping app, but phones aren't great at detecting your heading when you're not at driving speed and the walking directions mode was awful. As a result, it was basically a dumb map with lots of excellent live data on it and a "you are here" dot. A lot of people were having trouble with it because we're all used to "turn left here" instead of the top-view get-your-bearings go-that-way approach to a map.