3 ms·

> fanless cooling solutions which tends to degrade after a few years. Thermal expansion/contraction between cooler and chip itself "pumps" out the thermal past

> fanless cooling solutions which tends to degrade after a few years. Thermal expansion/contraction between cooler and chip itself "pumps" out the thermal paste which over time degrades cooling performance. If the system is running 24/7 its probably not as noticeable because you don't get the frequent heating/cooling you'd see on a device that gets power cycled often. Nothing a repaste job wont fix.

vincnetas 4y ago
is it theoretically possible to have cooling paste be jelly like? so it just returns to previous position after cooling down? or its just to irrelevat problem to invest in it?
- rocqua 4y ago
  It is, and thermal paste manufacturers need to balance performance against thermal cycling effects.
- ksec 4y ago
  >is it theoretically possible to have cooling paste be jelly like? That is already available and used in some Laptops. Look up Honeywell thermal pad. The problem is as always, cost.
  - numpad0 4y ago
    I thought thermal pads are generally thicker and less performant
    - IlGrigiore 4y ago
      There are thermal pads that perform equally or better than thermal pastes, due to their design. In particular, something like https://thermalmanagement.honeywell.com/us/en/products/thermal-interface-materials/phase-change-materials/ptm7000-series https://thermalmanagement.honeywell.com/us/en/products/therm... can be better than a good thermal paste like https://www.thermal-grizzly.com/en/products/16-kryonaut-en https://www.thermal-grizzly.com/en/products/16-kryonaut-en. The thermal conductivity is improved due to the use of a phase shifting material. Reliability is improved due to the fact that it will naturally return to solid without cracking during heat cycling.
trompetenaccoun 4y ago
Are there designs that don't use thermal paste? As I understand it regardless of solution you need paste or live with significantly reduced conductivity. That goes for any system - fan cooled, liquid cooled, passive,...
- Latty 4y ago
  Graphite thermal pads are available for consumers (e.g: Thermal Grizzly Carbonaut, IC Diamond Graphite) which offer similar performance (within 5°C) to paste without this issue.
  - andy_ppp 4y ago
    Does Apple use paste or pads in the MacBook air? Edit: to answer my own question it looks like Apple uses thermal paste but the cooling in the M2 MacBook Air looks extremely flimsey to the point of being almost non-existent. I doubt it will be affected much at all by this.
- ethbr0 4y ago
  You're looking for phase change materials (PCM), which soften at the desired operating temperature. Prevents pumping out because it's still mostly-solid. E.g. https://thermalmanagement.honeywell.com/us/en/products/thermal-interface-materials/phase-change-materials https://thermalmanagement.honeywell.com/us/en/products/therm...
- sandworm101 4y ago
  >> Are there designs that don't use thermal paste? Yes. Glue. Paste is for when you might want to one day separate part from heatsink. If you don't care about repairs, it is perfectly reasonable to just glue them together with thermal adhesive.

vincnetas 4y ago

is it theoretically possible to have cooling paste be jelly like? so it just returns to previous position after cooling down? or its just to irrelevat problem to invest in it?

rocqua 4y ago
It is, and thermal paste manufacturers need to balance performance against thermal cycling effects.
ksec 4y ago
>is it theoretically possible to have cooling paste be jelly like? That is already available and used in some Laptops. Look up Honeywell thermal pad. The problem is as always, cost.
- numpad0 4y ago
  I thought thermal pads are generally thicker and less performant
  - IlGrigiore 4y ago
    There are thermal pads that perform equally or better than thermal pastes, due to their design. In particular, something like https://thermalmanagement.honeywell.com/us/en/products/thermal-interface-materials/phase-change-materials/ptm7000-series https://thermalmanagement.honeywell.com/us/en/products/therm... can be better than a good thermal paste like https://www.thermal-grizzly.com/en/products/16-kryonaut-en https://www.thermal-grizzly.com/en/products/16-kryonaut-en. The thermal conductivity is improved due to the use of a phase shifting material. Reliability is improved due to the fact that it will naturally return to solid without cracking during heat cycling.

trompetenaccoun 4y ago

Are there designs that don't use thermal paste? As I understand it regardless of solution you need paste or live with significantly reduced conductivity. That goes for any system - fan cooled, liquid cooled, passive,...

Latty 4y ago
Graphite thermal pads are available for consumers (e.g: Thermal Grizzly Carbonaut, IC Diamond Graphite) which offer similar performance (within 5°C) to paste without this issue.
- andy_ppp 4y ago
  Does Apple use paste or pads in the MacBook air? Edit: to answer my own question it looks like Apple uses thermal paste but the cooling in the M2 MacBook Air looks extremely flimsey to the point of being almost non-existent. I doubt it will be affected much at all by this.
ethbr0 4y ago
You're looking for phase change materials (PCM), which soften at the desired operating temperature. Prevents pumping out because it's still mostly-solid. E.g. https://thermalmanagement.honeywell.com/us/en/products/thermal-interface-materials/phase-change-materials https://thermalmanagement.honeywell.com/us/en/products/therm...
sandworm101 4y ago
>> Are there designs that don't use thermal paste? Yes. Glue. Paste is for when you might want to one day separate part from heatsink. If you don't care about repairs, it is perfectly reasonable to just glue them together with thermal adhesive.