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I'm tired of people claiming that this war is all about other countries and their complicated geo-political agendas: the US, Germany, Russia. Why do America's r

by injb 4y ago

I'm tired of people claiming that this war is all about other countries and their complicated geo-political agendas: the US, Germany, Russia. Why do America's reasons for wanting Ukraine to join NATO, or Russia's reasons for wanting to stop them matter so much? Ukraine wanted to join. That is enough. NATO has expanded because all those countries wanted to join.

croes 4y ago
Didn't the mess start when the EU forced a decision between partnership with the EU or Russia without allowing both?
netsharc 4y ago
At least one should evaluate other arguments before saying they don't matter. If we believe what people say about what Putin is thinking, he's really paranoid that NATO is going from strength to strength because it's planning to sooner or later invade Russia. It's amazing how this paranoia in 1 little guy's mind has messed up the world so much. But maybe he has more proof than just his fears... And you say the countries want to join and that's enough? Huh, maybe we can evaluate their motivation for wanting to do so? To use a different example, if a partner wants to break up with you, would you ask "But why?" or do you just say "OK, you want it, so that's enough of a reason."...
aaplok 4y ago
> NATO has expanded because all those countries wanted to join. Joining NATO is not like taking a membership card at one's local gym when one feels like it. If, say, Sierra Leone "wanted to join" it's unlikely it would happen. NATO is a military alliance. It has a purpose, it has a governance and it doesn't just randomly expand to whichever country feels like joining. It's understandable that analysts analyze the expansion of NATO in a broader context. It would be naive not to.
leobg 4y ago
Cuba also just “wanted to join” back in 1962. It’s their territory. Can station as many missiles there as they want, can’t they? Kind of like it’s your neighbor’s business if he runs his leaf blower 4 hours a day. His lawn. His choice. If you get angry about this, you’re just being irrational. Probably isn’t even about the leaf blower at all. You’re just using that as an excuse. In truth, you just want to extend your influence and throw your own weight around.

by injb 4y ago

croes 4y ago

Didn't the mess start when the EU forced a decision between partnership with the EU or Russia without allowing both?

netsharc 4y ago

At least one should evaluate other arguments before saying they don't matter. If we believe what people say about what Putin is thinking, he's really paranoid that NATO is going from strength to strength because it's planning to sooner or later invade Russia. It's amazing how this paranoia in 1 little guy's mind has messed up the world so much. But maybe he has more proof than just his fears... And you say the countries want to join and that's enough? Huh, maybe we can evaluate their motivation for wanting to do so? To use a different example, if a partner wants to break up with you, would you ask "But why?" or do you just say "OK, you want it, so that's enough of a reason."...

aaplok 4y ago

> NATO has expanded because all those countries wanted to join. Joining NATO is not like taking a membership card at one's local gym when one feels like it. If, say, Sierra Leone "wanted to join" it's unlikely it would happen. NATO is a military alliance. It has a purpose, it has a governance and it doesn't just randomly expand to whichever country feels like joining. It's understandable that analysts analyze the expansion of NATO in a broader context. It would be naive not to.

leobg 4y ago

Cuba also just “wanted to join” back in 1962. It’s their territory. Can station as many missiles there as they want, can’t they? Kind of like it’s your neighbor’s business if he runs his leaf blower 4 hours a day. His lawn. His choice. If you get angry about this, you’re just being irrational. Probably isn’t even about the leaf blower at all. You’re just using that as an excuse. In truth, you just want to extend your influence and throw your own weight around.