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> it seems more like a moneymaking machine than something that actually has some worthwhile results The flu vaccine is absolutely not a moneymaking enterprise

> it seems more like a moneymaking machine than something that actually has some worthwhile results The flu vaccine is absolutely not a moneymaking enterprise (unless you define "money-making" as "spending less money on treating serious flu cases and sequelae", at which point you might as well leverage that same logic to argue against all preventive care). > 40% is terrible for something like gonorrhea, so unless it becomes much better you're better off being more diligent in your sexual escapades. This is a common attitude amongst the public, but it is completely at odds with how public health officials operate, because it's incredibly harmful and counterproductive. Shaming people for sexual activity might feel good and "moral", but not only does it not actually reduce incidence, but it increases the rate of STI transmission. 40% is not perfect, and it's insufficient to merit mass public vaccination, but it's more than adequate for protecting high-risk groups.

rjzzleep 4y ago
> This is a common attitude amongst the public, but it is completely at odds with how public health officials operate, because it's incredibly harmful and counterproductive. That's an ABSURD statement. Your statement is completely at odds with how public health operates in most countries. I've worked in it both in the US and in Germany, and worked with two more countries' health systems. In Germany at a leadership level, that is actually very close to the layer that decides what gets covered by public health insurance. Most public health insurance only covers older treatments because the new treatments are too risky for them with too little data on successful treatments. Things such as shockwave treatment that performance athletes frequently use or mothers use for their thumb after breastfeeding are completely out of pocket, because not enough longterm studies show statistical significance on the treatment. I understand that public health officials in the RECENT years(ten years is considered recent in public health or healthcare in general by the way) are trying to completely change the way public health works, because they want more direct control, but it is absolutely not YET how it works.
- deleted 4y ago
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- JumpCrisscross 4y ago
  > public health insurance only covers older treatments because the new treatments are too risky for them with too little data on successful treatments They’re also more expensive.
onlyrealcuzzo 4y ago
I'd rather have a 40% less chance of getting gonorrhea than a 0% less chance.
droopyEyelids 4y ago
Its complex but you should try and separate your idea of “shame” from the concept of “consequence”. People can change behavior to avoid consequence. Shame is a response to violations of morality. They're really quite distinct.
- inglor_cz 4y ago
  "Its complex but you should try and separate your idea of “shame” from the concept of “consequence”" Quite a lot of people are lately invested into the opposite, confusing those two, perhaps deliberately so. For example, any suggestion that it may be unsafe to walk around totally drunk at night will be met with accusations of "blaming the victim", especially if the crime is rape, plus with (unhelpful) suggestions "you men need stop raping, I don't need to alter my behavior" - as if the perps were present in the discussion and inclined to take such suggestions. Walking around totally drunk is unsafe for everybody, not least because all those self-inflicted injuries, but some people will deliberately try to silence such an idea.

rjzzleep 4y ago

> This is a common attitude amongst the public, but it is completely at odds with how public health officials operate, because it's incredibly harmful and counterproductive. That's an ABSURD statement. Your statement is completely at odds with how public health operates in most countries. I've worked in it both in the US and in Germany, and worked with two more countries' health systems. In Germany at a leadership level, that is actually very close to the layer that decides what gets covered by public health insurance. Most public health insurance only covers older treatments because the new treatments are too risky for them with too little data on successful treatments. Things such as shockwave treatment that performance athletes frequently use or mothers use for their thumb after breastfeeding are completely out of pocket, because not enough longterm studies show statistical significance on the treatment. I understand that public health officials in the RECENT years(ten years is considered recent in public health or healthcare in general by the way) are trying to completely change the way public health works, because they want more direct control, but it is absolutely not YET how it works.

deleted 4y ago
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JumpCrisscross 4y ago
> public health insurance only covers older treatments because the new treatments are too risky for them with too little data on successful treatments They’re also more expensive.

onlyrealcuzzo 4y ago

I'd rather have a 40% less chance of getting gonorrhea than a 0% less chance.

droopyEyelids 4y ago

Its complex but you should try and separate your idea of “shame” from the concept of “consequence”. People can change behavior to avoid consequence. Shame is a response to violations of morality. They're really quite distinct.

inglor_cz 4y ago
"Its complex but you should try and separate your idea of “shame” from the concept of “consequence”" Quite a lot of people are lately invested into the opposite, confusing those two, perhaps deliberately so. For example, any suggestion that it may be unsafe to walk around totally drunk at night will be met with accusations of "blaming the victim", especially if the crime is rape, plus with (unhelpful) suggestions "you men need stop raping, I don't need to alter my behavior" - as if the perps were present in the discussion and inclined to take such suggestions. Walking around totally drunk is unsafe for everybody, not least because all those self-inflicted injuries, but some people will deliberately try to silence such an idea.