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Alright, sure. But you need to prove negligence. It's impossible to write perfect code right? You really have to prove whatever breach/error happened wasn't on

by alar44 4y ago

Alright, sure. But you need to prove negligence. It's impossible to write perfect code right? You really have to prove whatever breach/error happened wasn't on purpose and wasn't due to gross negligence.

azemetre 4y ago
Imagine a world where all software is written using formal methods [1], that would be heaven. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formal_methods https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formal_methods
- yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago
  Heaven if you like living in a world where it takes months to ship even simple software. Don't get me wrong, I think we're too sloppy most of the time, but it's a trade off, not one sided.
  - namaria 4y ago
    Maybe it's not such a good idea to run so much critical stuff through systems built in weeks...
    - yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago
      I was responding to > Imagine a world where all software is written using formal methods (emphasis mine) I would be much more agreeable to enforcing higher quality for more important things, including ex. systems that store PII for large numbers of people.
- radicaldreamer 4y ago
  This would kill hacking and experimentation.
beart 4y ago
> Last year, Bellevue, Washington-based T-Mobile agreed to pay $350 million and spend an additional $150 million to upgrade data security to settle litigation over a cyberattack in 2021 that compromised information belonging to an estimated 76.6 million people. And they were still breached. "gross negligence" definitely comes to mind.
namaria 4y ago
Ancient Rome was filled with unsound residential development that yielded a lot of profits to anyone with means and influence to erect buildings. They would regularly collapse but common people had little access to legal protection. Now we have strict building codes and thousands of buildings with dozens upon dozens of floors that can resist hurricanes and earthquakes. Software development is barely 3 generations old. One day we will have sound engineering and fairly solid systems on a scale we can't even fathom today. But it will take a lot of collective learning. For now rickety systems can hoover enough value for their owners that they are still getting built all over the place.

by alar44 4y ago

azemetre 4y ago

Imagine a world where all software is written using formal methods [1], that would be heaven. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formal_methods https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formal_methods

yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago
Heaven if you like living in a world where it takes months to ship even simple software. Don't get me wrong, I think we're too sloppy most of the time, but it's a trade off, not one sided.
- namaria 4y ago
  Maybe it's not such a good idea to run so much critical stuff through systems built in weeks...
  - yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago
    I was responding to > Imagine a world where all software is written using formal methods (emphasis mine) I would be much more agreeable to enforcing higher quality for more important things, including ex. systems that store PII for large numbers of people.
radicaldreamer 4y ago
This would kill hacking and experimentation.

beart 4y ago

> Last year, Bellevue, Washington-based T-Mobile agreed to pay $350 million and spend an additional $150 million to upgrade data security to settle litigation over a cyberattack in 2021 that compromised information belonging to an estimated 76.6 million people. And they were still breached. "gross negligence" definitely comes to mind.

namaria 4y ago

Ancient Rome was filled with unsound residential development that yielded a lot of profits to anyone with means and influence to erect buildings. They would regularly collapse but common people had little access to legal protection. Now we have strict building codes and thousands of buildings with dozens upon dozens of floors that can resist hurricanes and earthquakes. Software development is barely 3 generations old. One day we will have sound engineering and fairly solid systems on a scale we can't even fathom today. But it will take a lot of collective learning. For now rickety systems can hoover enough value for their owners that they are still getting built all over the place.