28 ms·

Breaking story: website uses Google Analytics like 95% of other websites. Why is this even a story?

ClumsyPilot 4y ago
becauae it is then possible to obtain this data and imprison them
nerdjon 4y ago
It is going to continue to be a story until we take this data collection seriously and actually try to curtail it. We can't just wipe it away with "we already know this is happening" when its wrong in the first place.
nickthegreek 4y ago
It is a story because some states might be able to sue for information regarding visitors to those sites due to local laws. Its about informing citizens that their private purchases might not be as private as they want.
- raverbashing 4y ago
  Looks like the GDPR worries about privacy and data sent independent to 3rd parties had some merit
  - chopin 4y ago
    Websites subject to GDPR use Google Analytics left and right. Even government websites do this. GDPR has good intentions but enforcement is lacking severely.
    - robertlagrant 4y ago
      GDPR isn't intended to stop its use. It's intended to inform users of data sharing and provide them a mechanism to subsequently delete.
      - TylerE 4y ago
        Instead it's just another way to train users to click Yes/Accept without thinking! How could this possibly go wrong?
        mrguyorama 4y ago
        Actually, the longer GDPR has been around, the more I see websites popping up with a comprehensive modal that gives gentle explanations of what each toggle does. Hell, now some websites even default to "non-required" tracking off, and literally do not require you to do anything to limit the data they harvest from you. And I'm pretty sure this is some third party's drop in solution.
        robertlagrant 4y ago
        > Instead it's just another way to train users to click Yes/Accept without thinking! How could this possibly go wrong? GDPR doesn't specify UX.
      - Nextgrid 4y ago
        It's intended to ask users for consent before stalking them. But lack of enforcement means that in practice implementations use a non-compliant popup that forces users to accept (and is often technically flawed in that the tracking scripts are loaded regardless of the user's answer).
- ensignavenger 4y ago
  Presumably the person ordering these drugs is already providing the site with payment information (credit card) and a shipping address... seems like anyone suing for this information would probably start there rather than with google analytics.
  - RajT88 4y ago
    I am not going to visit or look up these sites on my work computer. But if they are headquartered outside the US like many online pharmacies are, likely they are going to just ignore any law enforcement requests for user data. Putting myself in the shoes of an online pharmacy selling abortion meds, I would be crazy to headquarter in the US. I'd be surprised if even a few were US-based.
    - yunohn 4y ago
      Quite a few of the websites from the article claim to be USA based.
tonywebster 4y ago
I think bringing attention to common practices putting people in jeopardy is a good thing, because it’s likely website operators and the general public don’t think about these risks. If data is collected, it can be used by police and prosecutors. Ignoring the problem because everyone knows about analytics does not start necessary conversations. Google has increasingly been a target for law enforcement investigations, and the search warrants Google receives can be as broad as compelling Google to turn over data on the accounts or IP addresses of anyone who Googled someone’s name.[1] [1] https://www.techdirt.com/2017/03/17/judge-grants-search-warrant-demanding-info-everyone-who-searched-certain-persons-name/ https://www.techdirt.com/2017/03/17/judge-grants-search-warr...
- ehhthing 4y ago
  Shouldn't this be a discussion about how law enforcement search powers are getting out of control, then?
  - ceejayoz 4y ago
    Law enforcement searches aren't the only risk here.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - lostlogin 4y ago
    The state controlling reproduction is the alarming bit for me, closely followed by the surveillance creepiness Google enables.
  - bee_rider 4y ago
    That’s another worthwhile topic, but since the privacy threat model of a companies selling some types of birth control will be unusual for the foreseeable future, it is also worth talking about in isolation.
    - bee_rider 4y ago
j45 4y ago
It is immature journalism. Either the writer or an editor who ultimately decided on the headline.
paulryanrogers 4y ago
Because it could lead to prosecuting women for exercising reproductive rights?
- lostlogin 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - willcipriano 4y ago
    It never was, Roe was a bad ruling.
bagels 4y ago
It may be a violation of HIPAA for the pharmacies to be doing this.
b1n 4y ago
Because it IS news to a lot of people. And putting it in context brings home the reality and implications of tracking that many people may not be aware of. If you've ever seen any SaaS websites where they have... - Our Product vs Competitor 1 - Our Product vs Competitor 2 - Our Product vs Competitor 3 - Our Product vs etc... ... then you can see why this is important from an SEO perspective.
godelski 4y ago
Just because something is obvious to you doesn't mean it is to others. You're in a bubble if you think everyone is highly tech literate.
- t433 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - godelski 4y ago
    Even though I disagree with the parent, HN has strict guidelines about calling people names and I'm actually in favor of these guidelines. We all fall prey to our emotions so please just edit the comment. If HN is overflowing with clowns we have to take extra caution not to become one ourselves and to dissuade them from coming here.
    - t433 4y ago
      [flagged]
libraryatnight 4y ago
[flagged]
33955985 4y ago
That you don’t think the possibility of governments prosecuting vulnerable women seeking health care in the US using surveillance capitalist tools is a story says more about you than the article.
wodenokoto 4y ago
It’s the surprising consequences of this. The privacy implications here are totally different than for a travel blog.
toss1 4y ago
Because in this instance, the consequence is that this data can now enable a quasi-fascist minority to impose their religious views on others, with consequences of serious jail time for (in other states) innocent and vulnerable women. When will people realize that surveillance capitalism is morally bankrupt (aside from also being a fraud), and that personally identifiable information is toxic waste? This is so far beyond "Don't Be Evil" . . .
brodouevencode 4y ago
Because it is centered around a highly divisive topic abortion. If it were anything else no one would care, even activities that are not widely legal. For example: Online retailers selling marijuana products send fingerprints to Google Analytics overwhelming majority would not care Brothels selling appointments online send fingerprints to Google Analytics overwhelming majority would not care Online retailers selling firearms send fingerprints to Google Analytics overwhelming majority would not care
- Bud 4y ago
  [dead]
- dsfyu404ed 4y ago
  Firearms people get pissed over the tracking. Before it was more broadly legal weed people used to be pissed over that. I presume the kind people who book prostitutes online don't like the data trail either. The reason you're hearing about of this is because HN cares a lot about abortion whereas all those other topics are of much less importance around here.
tomjen3 4y ago
Not breaking news: business has surveilance cameras. Breaking news: the business is a gym, and the area includes the showers.
jjav 4y ago
> Why is this even a story? It's a story because it's a privacy violation and also a HIPAA violation. Very similar to the case where health care providers were using Facebook trackers which was sending PII and PHI (private health info) to Facebook which has triggered multiple lawsuits. https://themarkup.org/pixel-hunt/2022/06/16/facebook-is-receiving-sensitive-medical-information-from-hospital-websites https://themarkup.org/pixel-hunt/2022/06/16/facebook-is-rece... It's great that some light is being shined on these violations. You can't just put spyware tracking on sensitive websites.

becauae it is then possible to obtain this data and imprison them

It is going to continue to be a story until we take this data collection seriously and actually try to curtail it. We can't just wipe it away with "we already know this is happening" when its wrong in the first place.

nickthegreek 4y ago

It is a story because some states might be able to sue for information regarding visitors to those sites due to local laws. Its about informing citizens that their private purchases might not be as private as they want.

raverbashing 4y ago
Looks like the GDPR worries about privacy and data sent independent to 3rd parties had some merit
- chopin 4y ago
  Websites subject to GDPR use Google Analytics left and right. Even government websites do this. GDPR has good intentions but enforcement is lacking severely.
  - robertlagrant 4y ago
    GDPR isn't intended to stop its use. It's intended to inform users of data sharing and provide them a mechanism to subsequently delete.
    - TylerE 4y ago
      Instead it's just another way to train users to click Yes/Accept without thinking! How could this possibly go wrong?
      - mrguyorama 4y ago
        Actually, the longer GDPR has been around, the more I see websites popping up with a comprehensive modal that gives gentle explanations of what each toggle does. Hell, now some websites even default to "non-required" tracking off, and literally do not require you to do anything to limit the data they harvest from you. And I'm pretty sure this is some third party's drop in solution.
      - robertlagrant 4y ago
        > Instead it's just another way to train users to click Yes/Accept without thinking! How could this possibly go wrong? GDPR doesn't specify UX.
    - Nextgrid 4y ago
      It's intended to ask users for consent before stalking them. But lack of enforcement means that in practice implementations use a non-compliant popup that forces users to accept (and is often technically flawed in that the tracking scripts are loaded regardless of the user's answer).
ensignavenger 4y ago
Presumably the person ordering these drugs is already providing the site with payment information (credit card) and a shipping address... seems like anyone suing for this information would probably start there rather than with google analytics.
- RajT88 4y ago
  I am not going to visit or look up these sites on my work computer. But if they are headquartered outside the US like many online pharmacies are, likely they are going to just ignore any law enforcement requests for user data. Putting myself in the shoes of an online pharmacy selling abortion meds, I would be crazy to headquarter in the US. I'd be surprised if even a few were US-based.
  - yunohn 4y ago
    Quite a few of the websites from the article claim to be USA based.

tonywebster 4y ago

I think bringing attention to common practices putting people in jeopardy is a good thing, because it’s likely website operators and the general public don’t think about these risks. If data is collected, it can be used by police and prosecutors. Ignoring the problem because everyone knows about analytics does not start necessary conversations. Google has increasingly been a target for law enforcement investigations, and the search warrants Google receives can be as broad as compelling Google to turn over data on the accounts or IP addresses of anyone who Googled someone’s name.[1] [1] https://www.techdirt.com/2017/03/17/judge-grants-search-warrant-demanding-info-everyone-who-searched-certain-persons-name/ https://www.techdirt.com/2017/03/17/judge-grants-search-warr...

ehhthing 4y ago
Shouldn't this be a discussion about how law enforcement search powers are getting out of control, then?
- ceejayoz 4y ago
  Law enforcement searches aren't the only risk here.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- lostlogin 4y ago
  The state controlling reproduction is the alarming bit for me, closely followed by the surveillance creepiness Google enables.
- bee_rider 4y ago
  That’s another worthwhile topic, but since the privacy threat model of a companies selling some types of birth control will be unusual for the foreseeable future, it is also worth talking about in isolation.
  - bee_rider 4y ago

j45 4y ago

It is immature journalism. Either the writer or an editor who ultimately decided on the headline.

paulryanrogers 4y ago

Because it could lead to prosecuting women for exercising reproductive rights?

lostlogin 4y ago
[flagged]
- willcipriano 4y ago
  It never was, Roe was a bad ruling.

bagels 4y ago

It may be a violation of HIPAA for the pharmacies to be doing this.

b1n 4y ago

Because it IS news to a lot of people. And putting it in context brings home the reality and implications of tracking that many people may not be aware of. If you've ever seen any SaaS websites where they have... - Our Product vs Competitor 1 - Our Product vs Competitor 2 - Our Product vs Competitor 3 - Our Product vs etc... ... then you can see why this is important from an SEO perspective.

godelski 4y ago

Just because something is obvious to you doesn't mean it is to others. You're in a bubble if you think everyone is highly tech literate.

t433 4y ago
[flagged]
- godelski 4y ago
  Even though I disagree with the parent, HN has strict guidelines about calling people names and I'm actually in favor of these guidelines. We all fall prey to our emotions so please just edit the comment. If HN is overflowing with clowns we have to take extra caution not to become one ourselves and to dissuade them from coming here.
  - t433 4y ago
    [flagged]

libraryatnight 4y ago

[flagged]

33955985 4y ago

That you don’t think the possibility of governments prosecuting vulnerable women seeking health care in the US using surveillance capitalist tools is a story says more about you than the article.

wodenokoto 4y ago

It’s the surprising consequences of this. The privacy implications here are totally different than for a travel blog.

toss1 4y ago

Because in this instance, the consequence is that this data can now enable a quasi-fascist minority to impose their religious views on others, with consequences of serious jail time for (in other states) innocent and vulnerable women. When will people realize that surveillance capitalism is morally bankrupt (aside from also being a fraud), and that personally identifiable information is toxic waste? This is so far beyond "Don't Be Evil" . . .

brodouevencode 4y ago

Because it is centered around a highly divisive topic abortion. If it were anything else no one would care, even activities that are not widely legal. For example: Online retailers selling marijuana products send fingerprints to Google Analytics overwhelming majority would not care Brothels selling appointments online send fingerprints to Google Analytics overwhelming majority would not care Online retailers selling firearms send fingerprints to Google Analytics overwhelming majority would not care

Bud 4y ago
[dead]
dsfyu404ed 4y ago
Firearms people get pissed over the tracking. Before it was more broadly legal weed people used to be pissed over that. I presume the kind people who book prostitutes online don't like the data trail either. The reason you're hearing about of this is because HN cares a lot about abortion whereas all those other topics are of much less importance around here.

tomjen3 4y ago

Not breaking news: business has surveilance cameras. Breaking news: the business is a gym, and the area includes the showers.

jjav 4y ago

> Why is this even a story? It's a story because it's a privacy violation and also a HIPAA violation. Very similar to the case where health care providers were using Facebook trackers which was sending PII and PHI (private health info) to Facebook which has triggered multiple lawsuits. https://themarkup.org/pixel-hunt/2022/06/16/facebook-is-receiving-sensitive-medical-information-from-hospital-websites https://themarkup.org/pixel-hunt/2022/06/16/facebook-is-rece... It's great that some light is being shined on these violations. You can't just put spyware tracking on sensitive websites.