4 ms·

> a jurisdiction that has decriminalized car theft Is this a thing?

zdragnar 4y ago
https://www.kare11.com/article/news/local/stolen-van-filled-with-tools-spotted-in-homeless-encampment-police-wont-help/89-3ed6aced-65c0-4558-9dc1-90ba7e994dc3#:~:text=Local%20News-,Frustration%20as%20stolen%20van%20filled%20with%20tools%20spotted%20in%20homeless,the%20encampment%20%22too%20hostile.%22 https://www.kare11.com/article/news/local/stolen-van-filled-... comes to mind, though I seem to recall similar other stories. Between the reactionary changes due to the public perception in the past few years, the defund movement undermining morale and other sundry causes, several major city departments are very understaffed and property crime investigation gets deprioritized pretty quickly. Edit: removed the editorializing paragraph prior to the article. It was largely redundant.
- throwifasd 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - _dain_ 4y ago
    I have strong beliefs, you have an opinion, he is editorializing.
  - zdragnar 4y ago
    Everything I listed are publicly given reasons that police departments have heard for the wave of early retirements and transfers out of troubled districts, and police have always prioritized response times based on capacity.
- coldpie 4y ago
  > the defund movement undermining morale The defund movement didn't spring from nowhere, it is a reaction to terrible policework. The police created the defund movement. Fix the police and it will go away.
  - zdragnar 4y ago
    This misses the point. Police departments are having a hard time recruiting; this is one of the reasons people don't want to work in these departments. They certainly need fixing, but I'm also not convinced that doing so will make the defund movement go away. Voices within what we are calling the "defund movement" range from "change how funds are allocated" to "abolish policing entirely". Ilhan Omar, as an example, said “The Minneapolis Police Department is rotten to the root, and so when we dismantle it, we get rid of that cancer, and we allow for something beautiful to rise, and that reimagining allows us to figure out what public safety looks like for us.” It isn't exactly a call for abolition, but it is saying get rid of them and we'll figure it out later. Her voice wasn't alone; the Minneapolis city council voted 12-0 to completely defund the department and replace the police with "peace officers" who presumably would have had different obligations in terms of interacting with people. That ended up never going anywhere; a spike in violent and property crime led the necessary city charter amendment to fail (Minneapolis city charter currently mandates a minimum staffing level of police, which it hasn't been able to meet since 2020). The political motivations behind this far end of the "defund" movement argue that policing simply cannot be successfully reformed - that there is no "fixing" the police.
    - coldpie 4y ago
      >Police departments are having a hard time recruiting; this is one of the reasons people don't want to work in these departments. Yeah, but your original statement is kind of a lie-by-omission. You're saying they're not able to hire because a bunch of people mistrust the police, as if the blame lays with those people for being mistrustful. But you're leaving out that they mistrust the police because of the police's own actions to earn that mistrust, repeated over decades. > the Minneapolis city council voted 12-0 to completely defund the department and replace the police with "peace officers" who presumably would have had different obligations in terms of interacting with people I live here and you're way wrong. Lisa Goodman would never have voted to "completely defund the police." In fact there was never a vote to "completely defund and replace [MPD]". As you said, they couldn't do that without changing the city charter. There was a long and bitter fight over that charter amendment, with the conservative wing of the council and the conservative mayor fighting and continuing to fight tooth & nail to shield MPD from all reform attempts. I can't think of any meaningful votes on this topic that went 12-0. I wonder what vote you are actually thinking of.

https://www.kare11.com/article/news/local/stolen-van-filled-with-tools-spotted-in-homeless-encampment-police-wont-help/89-3ed6aced-65c0-4558-9dc1-90ba7e994dc3#:~:text=Local%20News-,Frustration%20as%20stolen%20van%20filled%20with%20tools%20spotted%20in%20homeless,the%20encampment%20%22too%20hostile.%22 https://www.kare11.com/article/news/local/stolen-van-filled-... comes to mind, though I seem to recall similar other stories. Between the reactionary changes due to the public perception in the past few years, the defund movement undermining morale and other sundry causes, several major city departments are very understaffed and property crime investigation gets deprioritized pretty quickly. Edit: removed the editorializing paragraph prior to the article. It was largely redundant.

throwifasd 4y ago
[flagged]
- _dain_ 4y ago
  I have strong beliefs, you have an opinion, he is editorializing.
- zdragnar 4y ago
  Everything I listed are publicly given reasons that police departments have heard for the wave of early retirements and transfers out of troubled districts, and police have always prioritized response times based on capacity.
coldpie 4y ago
> the defund movement undermining morale The defund movement didn't spring from nowhere, it is a reaction to terrible policework. The police created the defund movement. Fix the police and it will go away.
- zdragnar 4y ago
  This misses the point. Police departments are having a hard time recruiting; this is one of the reasons people don't want to work in these departments. They certainly need fixing, but I'm also not convinced that doing so will make the defund movement go away. Voices within what we are calling the "defund movement" range from "change how funds are allocated" to "abolish policing entirely". Ilhan Omar, as an example, said “The Minneapolis Police Department is rotten to the root, and so when we dismantle it, we get rid of that cancer, and we allow for something beautiful to rise, and that reimagining allows us to figure out what public safety looks like for us.” It isn't exactly a call for abolition, but it is saying get rid of them and we'll figure it out later. Her voice wasn't alone; the Minneapolis city council voted 12-0 to completely defund the department and replace the police with "peace officers" who presumably would have had different obligations in terms of interacting with people. That ended up never going anywhere; a spike in violent and property crime led the necessary city charter amendment to fail (Minneapolis city charter currently mandates a minimum staffing level of police, which it hasn't been able to meet since 2020). The political motivations behind this far end of the "defund" movement argue that policing simply cannot be successfully reformed - that there is no "fixing" the police.
  - coldpie 4y ago
    >Police departments are having a hard time recruiting; this is one of the reasons people don't want to work in these departments. Yeah, but your original statement is kind of a lie-by-omission. You're saying they're not able to hire because a bunch of people mistrust the police, as if the blame lays with those people for being mistrustful. But you're leaving out that they mistrust the police because of the police's own actions to earn that mistrust, repeated over decades. > the Minneapolis city council voted 12-0 to completely defund the department and replace the police with "peace officers" who presumably would have had different obligations in terms of interacting with people I live here and you're way wrong. Lisa Goodman would never have voted to "completely defund the police." In fact there was never a vote to "completely defund and replace [MPD]". As you said, they couldn't do that without changing the city charter. There was a long and bitter fight over that charter amendment, with the conservative wing of the council and the conservative mayor fighting and continuing to fight tooth & nail to shield MPD from all reform attempts. I can't think of any meaningful votes on this topic that went 12-0. I wonder what vote you are actually thinking of.