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I don't believe that Windows 7 will really improve on Vista's issues. Mainly because the real problems with Vista are either imaginary (cf. Mojave) or completel

by thras 18y ago

I don't believe that Windows 7 will really improve on Vista's issues. Mainly because the real problems with Vista are either imaginary (cf. Mojave) or completely out of Microsoft's control (third party applications, drivers). A fundamental problem with Vista was that switching operating systems is a pain and users don't like to do it. Further, Apple and Linux now have a lot of mind share among the technical trendsetters. For Apple and Linux users, it's not enough to like Apple or Linux, you have to hate Microsoft too. When Windows 7 comes along, the press will be exactly the same as it was for Vista: Why switch when your programs already work on the old OS? Why won't it run on X or Y type ancient hardware? Etc, etc. And the Apple and Linux fans will make Windows 7 into exactly the same sort of dirty word that Vista is. Joe Average computer user doesn't choose his next OS based on what he likes, he does it based on what he hears, and that won't be anything good.

unalone 18y ago
Mainly because the real problems with Vista are either imaginary (cf. Mojave) This is a bullshit argument, and I'd really love people to stop using it. Mojave showed that people using Vista for short amounts of time in factory-approve conditions will think that it's "pretty neat." But Vista's always had the "neat" factor about it. Never as much as OS X, but then, not many people get a computer based on "neat" factor, despite what fanboys on both sides say about each other's products. Where Vista sours is when you use it for a while and notice the little things. Of course, the security windows - even though you can disable them, that's the iconic one for Vista. I've had that security window crash my old computer, too: if your computer is running a lot of stuff, that window sometimes tips the entire thing over. The little things bottle up. They build up and tip out. I just came across a post yesterday on Tumblr that mentioned one: I'd never actively thought about this feature, I wouldn't have ever thought to diss Vista for it after I got my Mac, but remembering it, it was awful in a small way. http://tumblelog.marco.org/56149922 http://tumblelog.marco.org/56149922 And when you've only used Windows, stuff like this is acceptable. It's commonplace. There is no alternative. But when you use any other OS, you realize that a lot of things are done much better. Linux has its own problems, namely drivers, but that was enough to make me hate Windows in no time at all. OS X is even worse for that, because it's better on an order of magnitude. And once a bunch of people started using OS X, and Apple started its campaign actively against Vista, people got very curious, and a lot of people starting noticing the things about Vista that pissed them off.
- thras 18y ago
  Sorry, but I run Linux, Windows, and OS X. Vista isn't worse than XP in any meaningful way (better in a few), and I have never run into any problems using it. OS X is pretty, but there is nothing about it that makes me go "wow!" And Linux is for people that know way too much about computers (like me, unfortunately) and who don't value their time enough (again me, apparently). I think that Apple can do really wonderful things -- my iPhone is miles ahead of any Windows Mobile phone I've ever owned. On the other hand, the Zune software simply destroys iTunes in usability and prettiness -- the Zune itself is a very nice device. The link that you referred to talks about Windows XP (2004 should have been a clue) and isn't quite accurate anyway. I think that Tumblr may want to concentrate on reading dialog boxes a little more carefully.
  - unalone 18y ago
    Every day that I use OS X I become more infatuated with it. It isn't perfect, but it's as close to as I've come using any computer. With Vista, I'm out of love the minute I see needless chrome on the windows. The same with the graphical Linux interfaces I've used. There's the first real biggie. The 1px border design from Apple is one that I absolutely love, and it makes every other design I've ever seen look stupid and outdated. The menu bar up top and the dock makes for the second thing. Both of them are so incredibly utilitarian. You don't get menus cluttering up every window. The fact that every menu usually complies with HIG and has the exact same keyboard shortcuts is another absolute wow gee love situation. It shouldn't be, but it is. I love knowing that CMD-, opens up preferences for every single application. I love being able to find what I want easily, because the menus are so standardized. And the dock made me hate the taskbar, because it makes the taskbar seem so incredibly outdated and useless. OS X doesn't just provide visuals. It provides a visual interface. Things make logical sense with it: they attempt to simulate a real physical interaction. Like the one I mentioned before: when you have a window open, the fact that you can move whatever file that window represents just by moving the window. Or the ability to move things to and from the dock, to use the dock as a storage space. Little things that just make perfect sense. Vista will not stop telling me to restart my computer. There is no "Fuck you, I'll install when I'm ready* option. It keeps popping up, and it keeps coming up as I'm hitting Enter for something else, and it keeps pissing me off. The Zune looks pretty, I'll agree. I don't like its scroll mechanism. And what about the Zune software is better than iTunes? I'm not denying you: I've just never used the Zune software, and I love iTunes. I'd be curious as to what the Zune program does better.
wizlb 18y ago
This is complete bullshit as well: "For Apple and Linux users, it's not enough to like Apple or Linux, you have to hate Microsoft too." Obviously, there are many people running all three. Where do you even get that idea from?
aneesh 18y ago
> When Windows 7 comes along, the press will be exactly the same as it was for Vista: Why switch when your programs already work on the old OS? Yeah, but remember, if you didn't switch to Vista, you'll still be running XP (which was released in 2001-ish). So you'll have to switch to something soon. Sure, some people will switch to Apple, but upgrading to Win 7 will almost be the default option. And if you did switch to Vista, then you'll probably move to Win 7 as well when it comes out. People could afford to ignore Vista because they were happy with XP, but they won't continue to be happy with XP indefinitely.

by thras 18y ago

unalone 18y ago

Mainly because the real problems with Vista are either imaginary (cf. Mojave) This is a bullshit argument, and I'd really love people to stop using it. Mojave showed that people using Vista for short amounts of time in factory-approve conditions will think that it's "pretty neat." But Vista's always had the "neat" factor about it. Never as much as OS X, but then, not many people get a computer based on "neat" factor, despite what fanboys on both sides say about each other's products. Where Vista sours is when you use it for a while and notice the little things. Of course, the security windows - even though you can disable them, that's the iconic one for Vista. I've had that security window crash my old computer, too: if your computer is running a lot of stuff, that window sometimes tips the entire thing over. The little things bottle up. They build up and tip out. I just came across a post yesterday on Tumblr that mentioned one: I'd never actively thought about this feature, I wouldn't have ever thought to diss Vista for it after I got my Mac, but remembering it, it was awful in a small way. http://tumblelog.marco.org/56149922 http://tumblelog.marco.org/56149922 And when you've only used Windows, stuff like this is acceptable. It's commonplace. There is no alternative. But when you use any other OS, you realize that a lot of things are done much better. Linux has its own problems, namely drivers, but that was enough to make me hate Windows in no time at all. OS X is even worse for that, because it's better on an order of magnitude. And once a bunch of people started using OS X, and Apple started its campaign actively against Vista, people got very curious, and a lot of people starting noticing the things about Vista that pissed them off.

thras 18y ago
Sorry, but I run Linux, Windows, and OS X. Vista isn't worse than XP in any meaningful way (better in a few), and I have never run into any problems using it. OS X is pretty, but there is nothing about it that makes me go "wow!" And Linux is for people that know way too much about computers (like me, unfortunately) and who don't value their time enough (again me, apparently). I think that Apple can do really wonderful things -- my iPhone is miles ahead of any Windows Mobile phone I've ever owned. On the other hand, the Zune software simply destroys iTunes in usability and prettiness -- the Zune itself is a very nice device. The link that you referred to talks about Windows XP (2004 should have been a clue) and isn't quite accurate anyway. I think that Tumblr may want to concentrate on reading dialog boxes a little more carefully.
- unalone 18y ago
  Every day that I use OS X I become more infatuated with it. It isn't perfect, but it's as close to as I've come using any computer. With Vista, I'm out of love the minute I see needless chrome on the windows. The same with the graphical Linux interfaces I've used. There's the first real biggie. The 1px border design from Apple is one that I absolutely love, and it makes every other design I've ever seen look stupid and outdated. The menu bar up top and the dock makes for the second thing. Both of them are so incredibly utilitarian. You don't get menus cluttering up every window. The fact that every menu usually complies with HIG and has the exact same keyboard shortcuts is another absolute wow gee love situation. It shouldn't be, but it is. I love knowing that CMD-, opens up preferences for every single application. I love being able to find what I want easily, because the menus are so standardized. And the dock made me hate the taskbar, because it makes the taskbar seem so incredibly outdated and useless. OS X doesn't just provide visuals. It provides a visual interface. Things make logical sense with it: they attempt to simulate a real physical interaction. Like the one I mentioned before: when you have a window open, the fact that you can move whatever file that window represents just by moving the window. Or the ability to move things to and from the dock, to use the dock as a storage space. Little things that just make perfect sense. Vista will not stop telling me to restart my computer. There is no "Fuck you, I'll install when I'm ready* option. It keeps popping up, and it keeps coming up as I'm hitting Enter for something else, and it keeps pissing me off. The Zune looks pretty, I'll agree. I don't like its scroll mechanism. And what about the Zune software is better than iTunes? I'm not denying you: I've just never used the Zune software, and I love iTunes. I'd be curious as to what the Zune program does better.

wizlb 18y ago

This is complete bullshit as well: "For Apple and Linux users, it's not enough to like Apple or Linux, you have to hate Microsoft too." Obviously, there are many people running all three. Where do you even get that idea from?

aneesh 18y ago

> When Windows 7 comes along, the press will be exactly the same as it was for Vista: Why switch when your programs already work on the old OS? Yeah, but remember, if you didn't switch to Vista, you'll still be running XP (which was released in 2001-ish). So you'll have to switch to something soon. Sure, some people will switch to Apple, but upgrading to Win 7 will almost be the default option. And if you did switch to Vista, then you'll probably move to Win 7 as well when it comes out. People could afford to ignore Vista because they were happy with XP, but they won't continue to be happy with XP indefinitely.