9 ms·

> Meanwhile it's an absolute no-brainer (for me and many other people) to avoid gas stoves, because they don't have any ambience benefits and my local power gri

> Meanwhile it's an absolute no-brainer (for me and many other people) to avoid gas stoves, because they don't have any ambience benefits and my local power grid is quite stable. Except that all the concern around gas stoves is mostly BS. The issue with cooking is not the heat source, it's actually the fumes from cooking itself. The ONLY safe way to cook from an indoor air quality perspective is to have a properly installed externally vented range hood (and makeup air if needed). It doesn't matter if you use induction, radiant, or coil electric, they all produce just as much cooking fumes as gas, and the gas burning has a negligible impact. I've confirmed this myself many times over with calibrated sensors. The worst thing about indoor air quality in the US is that the US doesn't require external venting in kitchens by code, and it should. The PM2.5 spikes in nearly every American household the moment someone starts cooking, and to dangerous levels for the person doing the cooking. American houses also have horrible ventilation generally, with newer houses being even worse as they get better sealed for efficiency, but without being required to provide active ventilation. It should be legally required that every home, including rental apartments, be constructed with an externally vented range hood and an energy recovery style active ventilation for fresh air exchange. I challenge folks to improve their indoor air quality and see how much it benefits them by simply opening your windows up at least once a day (which unfortunately isn't the most energy efficient thing to do), and finding a way to actively ventilate your kitchen when you cook (if nothing better, a box fan in an open window is not a bad way to go. recirculating range hoods do nothing).

danans 4y ago
> It doesn't matter if you use induction, radiant, or coil electric, they all produce just as much cooking fumes as gas, and the gas burning has a negligible impact. > I've confirmed this myself many times over with calibrated sensors. This really means nothing considering that rigorous studies and metastudies [1] have been performed and the results published that demonstrate the opposite: that gas stoves result in CO and other harmful emissions that electric stoves don't, independent of what is being cooked. Those studies aren't a global conspiracy against gas stoves. If you have similarly published your data and it has been reviewed, please do share it with the world. > The worst thing about indoor air quality in the US is that the US doesn't require external venting in kitchens by code, and it should I agree wholeheartedly, but the problem doesn't end there. Most range hoods in single family homes are externally vented, but there is a behavioral problem, which is that most people use the kitchen hood vent as a way to exhaust smoke odors only, usually only in response to a smoke alarm going off. Even worse, after enough rounds of this, many people end up disabling the smoke alarms near their kitchen rather than taking it as an indication that there is an air quality problem. If the only effect of these studies is to alert people to the necessity of turning on their hood vent and opening a window for makeup air every time they cook, especially on a gas stove, that's a win. 1. https://www.mdpi.com/1660-4601/17/23/8972 https://www.mdpi.com/1660-4601/17/23/8972
- tristor 4y ago
  > Most range hoods in single family homes are externally vented, I wish this were true, unfortunately it's not. Most homes in the US, including freestanding SFHs, use recirculating range hoods. > that gas stoves result in CO and other harmful emissions that electric stoves don't, independent of what is being cooked. This is true. It's also a negligible difference, and mostly immaterial if you are externally venting fumes when using the stove. The biggest issue is not the carbon monoxide and other emissions, it's the particulate matter that is given off when cooking, which happens quickly during cooking and irrespective of heat sources. Consistently breathing in high levels of PM2.5 has severe health consequences, including increasing risk for lung diseases and cancer, even when the particulates themselves are not carcinogenic. What's worse, many particulates given off when cooking /are/ carcinogenic, such as when searing meats. Ventilation is the most critical aspect here. There are more important safety reasons why people should avoid open flames and direct heat in favor of electric induction, as well as environmental reasons as all-electric homes can be powered using exclusively renewable energy sources, these are much better arguments against using a gas stove than the air emissions, which are insignificant compared to cooking fumes themselves and both need resolved via ventilation. > there is a behavioral problem, which is that most people use the kitchen hood vent as a way to exhaust smoke odors only Agreed. One of the challenges in the US is that because most range hoods are recirculating and not vented, especially in rental/cheaper properties, people become effectively trained to not use it because they are very loud and not effective. Externally vented range hoods are both quieter and are actually effective, and train people to use them once they're exposed to them. > many people end up disabling the smoke alarms near their kitchen rather than taking it as an indication that there is an air quality problem. This is a real issue, and a big issue for fire safety as well. Most American homes also don't have carbon monoxide or carbon dioxide monitoring, both of which are major issues. We also have significant exposure to radon in the US, and no state currently legally requires landlords to provide mitigation and testing for radon. There are myriad indoor air quality issues in the US, and proper ventilation can solve or mitigate almost all of them, and when it's present it does not train bad habits and may untrain bad habits.
  - danans 4y ago

danans 4y ago

> It doesn't matter if you use induction, radiant, or coil electric, they all produce just as much cooking fumes as gas, and the gas burning has a negligible impact. > I've confirmed this myself many times over with calibrated sensors. This really means nothing considering that rigorous studies and metastudies [1] have been performed and the results published that demonstrate the opposite: that gas stoves result in CO and other harmful emissions that electric stoves don't, independent of what is being cooked. Those studies aren't a global conspiracy against gas stoves. If you have similarly published your data and it has been reviewed, please do share it with the world. > The worst thing about indoor air quality in the US is that the US doesn't require external venting in kitchens by code, and it should I agree wholeheartedly, but the problem doesn't end there. Most range hoods in single family homes are externally vented, but there is a behavioral problem, which is that most people use the kitchen hood vent as a way to exhaust smoke odors only, usually only in response to a smoke alarm going off. Even worse, after enough rounds of this, many people end up disabling the smoke alarms near their kitchen rather than taking it as an indication that there is an air quality problem. If the only effect of these studies is to alert people to the necessity of turning on their hood vent and opening a window for makeup air every time they cook, especially on a gas stove, that's a win. 1. https://www.mdpi.com/1660-4601/17/23/8972 https://www.mdpi.com/1660-4601/17/23/8972

tristor 4y ago
> Most range hoods in single family homes are externally vented, I wish this were true, unfortunately it's not. Most homes in the US, including freestanding SFHs, use recirculating range hoods. > that gas stoves result in CO and other harmful emissions that electric stoves don't, independent of what is being cooked. This is true. It's also a negligible difference, and mostly immaterial if you are externally venting fumes when using the stove. The biggest issue is not the carbon monoxide and other emissions, it's the particulate matter that is given off when cooking, which happens quickly during cooking and irrespective of heat sources. Consistently breathing in high levels of PM2.5 has severe health consequences, including increasing risk for lung diseases and cancer, even when the particulates themselves are not carcinogenic. What's worse, many particulates given off when cooking /are/ carcinogenic, such as when searing meats. Ventilation is the most critical aspect here. There are more important safety reasons why people should avoid open flames and direct heat in favor of electric induction, as well as environmental reasons as all-electric homes can be powered using exclusively renewable energy sources, these are much better arguments against using a gas stove than the air emissions, which are insignificant compared to cooking fumes themselves and both need resolved via ventilation. > there is a behavioral problem, which is that most people use the kitchen hood vent as a way to exhaust smoke odors only Agreed. One of the challenges in the US is that because most range hoods are recirculating and not vented, especially in rental/cheaper properties, people become effectively trained to not use it because they are very loud and not effective. Externally vented range hoods are both quieter and are actually effective, and train people to use them once they're exposed to them. > many people end up disabling the smoke alarms near their kitchen rather than taking it as an indication that there is an air quality problem. This is a real issue, and a big issue for fire safety as well. Most American homes also don't have carbon monoxide or carbon dioxide monitoring, both of which are major issues. We also have significant exposure to radon in the US, and no state currently legally requires landlords to provide mitigation and testing for radon. There are myriad indoor air quality issues in the US, and proper ventilation can solve or mitigate almost all of them, and when it's present it does not train bad habits and may untrain bad habits.
- danans 4y ago