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Free the nipple: Facebook and Instagram told to overhaul ban on bare breasts
- celu 4y ago[flagged]
- am_lu 4y agoI been watching one youtuber and his streams playing The Witcher 3 game. He has to censor the moments when he fights with certain beast, an Water Hag/Baba Wodna monstrosity. . Evil creature has a woman-like breast on display and hes seriously worried about getting demonetised by youtube for that.... Political correctness full on. https://witcher.fandom.com/wiki/Water_hag https://witcher.fandom.com/wiki/Water_hag
- kelseyfrog 4y agoOne of the reasons we can tell nipple bans are irrational is that no one is saying, "If I see nipples, it will harm me." It's always, "If someone else sees nipples, it will harm them." When folks try to police others nine times out of ten it's not actually to protect latter - rather it makes the former uncomfortable in ways they know won't hold up to scrutiny.
- DontchaKnowit 4y agoThis is weird to me. I find that people arguing on behalf of others is way more valid than whining about themselves.
- jfengel 4y agoAnd that's why they do it. It's a way of gaining apparent validity by expanding the group for whom you can claim harm. It goes off the rails when it's only others for whom harm is claimed. That's what makes children such a common trope here. Children will (almost) never say "this harms me". Instead, people get to claim something on behalf of the children, without fear of contradiction. No child gets to say "Hey, I wouldn't mind seeing some boobies." It's why Greta Thunberg caused such an uproar. She is a child, but got a platform to say, "Climate change harms me". It brought some credence to climate advocates who previously risked sounding like they were doing it "for the children" without the consent of any children.
- JonChesterfield 4y agoHow about people arguing on behalf of hypothetical / imaginary other people?
- psychphysic 4y agoThe reasoning is nonsense. It's just about being safe for work. As a man I can get away with a beach shot of me and a hypothetical son both without tops on. On my work desk. My hypothetical wife and daughter? Not so much.
- klyrs 4y agoYeah that's puritanism for ya. Where I live, it's technically legal for women to go topless anywhere men can. It would be interesting to test that as it applies to photographs in the workplace.
- runnerup 4y agoThis is true for a large portion of USA citizens as well. The lower bound on this is >13% of women in the USA can be topless anywhere that men are allowed to be topless. Purportedly, this includes the following jurisdictions: New York State 20200000 Wyoming 576851 Colorado 5773000 Utah 3271000 New Mexico 2117000 Kansas 2937000 Oklahoma 3959000 Austin, TX 961855 Asheville, NC 94000 Colombus, OH 906528 Eugene, OR 175000 Portland, OR 641000 D.C. 712800 New Orleans, LA 377000
- JumpinJack_Cash 4y agoIt's not a conspiracy, simply advertisers don't want to be associated with nipples and female nudity because according to their data and experience those ads don't convert (and generate negative press, but mostly don't convert) And it's true, I mean would you ever remember a logo or an ad you saw on PornHub or YouPorn? The PlayBoy magazine wasn't free, you had to subscribe to it because little money flowed into the business via ads. To put it lightly, focus of the consumer in those moments is elsewhere, not the ad. Advertisers love space which is placed in-between 2 slices of engaging (but not sexually engaging content), possibly where the viewer doesn't know when the advertisement will end and their favorite content is coming back on. That's the reason why SuperBowl ads and generally ads airing during live events such as NFL/NBA/MLB/NHL games are a favorite among brands
- kelseyfrog 4y agoIt sounds like we got different things from the article. That part that stood out to me was > The posts were flagged by users, then reviewed and removed by an AI system. To me this says that we're talking about a system that involves people who are telegraphing their dislike of nipple content. I agree with you that advertisers may have reservations about the content, but in this story advertisers aren't mentioned, only users who dislike nipple content are. Maybe there's something I'm missing, but I can't see a connection between advertisers not wanting to be associated with the content in a way that causes people to report nipple pictures.
- mrguyorama 4y agoRemember that the US still has a rather large population of religious and otherwise extremely socially conservative people. These people are against uncovered breasts in general, and it makes them extremely angry. They also tend to be well organized, persistent, and have enough smart people to be a problem. Pornhub being thrown off of credit card payment systems was mostly the doing of an anti-porn religious organization. That's what these brands are afraid of. Conservatives bitching about "cancel culture" have NOTHING on the wrath of religious folks if you step outside their prescribed notions of the world. Remember, people BOMBED abortion clinics, like, not rarely either.
- rcktmrtn 4y ago> It's always, "If someone else sees nipples, it will harm them." ... I find it more compelling to put it this way: "If we make [something currently seen as sexual] normal in public, it will harm society". There isn't anything more magically sexual about the nipple than there was about the thigh. It's an arbitrary line in the sand. Culture/advertising has exposed the fact it's arbitrary by pushing up against it, but maybe it's just as sensible to argue that the line should move back towards being more modest than being less so. There is a separate discussion about why women's norms are more restrictive than men's, but I think things have gotten more libertine across the board.
- kelseyfrog 4y agoI find "harm society" much less compelling. It acts like a smoke grenade in discussions, filling up a lot of space and obscuring the topic. The air can only be cleared by answering, "who?" and "which relations in society?" otherwise we're fighting clouds.
- vfclists 4y agoSuprising how quickly policies can change when the transgender perspective is brought to bear on it. Enough said. We are in the decade of the transgender. Wonder what the next decade holds.
- DontchaKnowit 4y agoWe are in the Aeon of the child according to Crowley. Do with that what you will
- mint2 4y agoI honestly have zero clue what this comment means. why are people expected to be familiar with some bloke named crowley? Whatever does aeon if the child mean? Are these tv show references? My best guess is either these are tv show references or the way some people try to obscure obviously objectionable/wrong statements in obscure references for people “in the know”. But I have zero clue what the statements mean. Or Was that comment posted in the wrong thread?
- saulpw 4y agoAleister Crowley was an occultist who dealt in Western esotericism. So either you're into that kind of stuff, or know about it, or it's not really for you. And anyway, with a simple search for "Crowley", the first link was his Wikipedia entry with all this information, so it's not exactly like you had to go digging in the dark corners of some exotic private library to figure it out.
- DontchaKnowit 4y agoSee the other comment, he is correct. Crowley believed that he was channeling knowledge from egyptian gods that would allow him to usher in the aeon of horus, which would be the aeon of the child. He believes we have been through eras of matriarchy and patriarchy and that we are entering the age of the child. My interpretation kf this is that this involves the subversion of the idea of objective truth, substituting it for a childlike naivete and selfishness that believes the world is created in the eye of the beholder.
- amanaplanacanal 4y agoAny gender based rules are prima facie discriminatory.
- thunky 4y agoI'd be ok with not allowing male nipples to be shown.
- seanw444 4y agoIt's funny to me that we're all born with female nipples, mens' just don't develop mass behind them, and that's apparently what makes them NSFW. But even flat-chested women are NSFW, even though it's almost no different appearance-wise?
- hulitu 4y ago> mens' just don't develop mass behind them, and that's apparently what makes them NSFW There are a lot of men lately with "mass" behind nipples which might be caused by the food (hormones ?).
- oneoff786 4y agoIt’s amusing when people complain about how some Islamic governments demand women cover their bodies and simultaneously demand women cover their breasts on largely Christian principles. Nips are honestly just not that interesting to look at.
- tmtvl 4y agoThere is a golden middle way somewhere between "have everyone covered up head to toe in as many layers as possible" and "let's all walk around naked". Along which axis you prefer to be will differ from person to person. As far as I'm concerned people can wear whatever they want as long as they're fine with others looking at them like they grew a third head.
- oneoff786 4y agoIt is already pretty strange to walk around shirtless as a man in normal context. I’m pretty sure women being topless at the beach could become normative to the point of being uninteresting in the blink of an eye though.
- subjectsigma 4y agoExample #N of a loud, coast-dwelling, white-collar minority overruling a silent majority. Go to a shitty bar and find someone who doesn’t look like you and ask them if they think you should be able to post topless women unrestricted. Statistically the answer is no.
- amanaplanacanal 4y agoAt one point I’m sure you could have asked whether black people should be allowed to marry white people, and gotten the same answer. I’m not sure that’s a good argument.
- subjectsigma 4y agoI think it’s pretty crude to conflate the literal civil rights movement and the campaign to “free” female nipples. However, I will point out that that change, while good and necessary, also happened over time. MLK won hearts and minds, he didn’t flip an algorithmic switch and decide for the population.
- inetknght 4y ago> I think it’s pretty crude to conflate the literal civil rights movement and the campaign to “free” female nipples. I agree it's a bit of a low-brow comparison. But nonetheless I think the comparison is apt.
- generj 4y agoHe largely did not win hearts and minds. What he did win was the court and a loud enough minority that politicians had to cave. When your cause can sign up an innumerable amount of clean dressed people to volunteer for mob attacks and imprisonment, society has to respect you lest these same committed souls decide dying for the cause might as well require enemies to the cause die as well. The Black Panthers and others had about reached that point, and the implicit threat that if society doesn’t create a true peace society doesn’t get peace was what created a civil rights victory. MLK Jr. was among the most controversial and least liked members of the country at his death and throughout his campaign for civil rights. Most people would have described the civil rights campaign as flipping a legislative switch deciding for the population.
- tmtvl 4y agoMaybe there could be a market for AR glasses that draw sweaters over topless people. Combined with smart internet filters who do the same for pictures and videos it would allow people to decide for themselves what they want or don't want to see without having to bother others. ...but then it may be used to hide advertisements and that would be bad for certain interests.
- glonq 4y agoWell there is very likely a market for AR glasses that draw "toplessness" over clothed people ;)
- colinwilyb 4y agoHow about a reverse ban where all fundamentalist religious bigots are banned instead?
- hulitu 4y ago> How about a reverse ban where all fundamentalist religious bigots are banned instead? They rule the world. Even in some democracies (US, etc).