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I like this, but ROI should never be part of the calculation for home building, it's why we have so much homelessness in the first place.

nine_k 4y ago
ROI should absolutely be a part of calculation, else it would be easy to spend (even) more money on a home that's not desirable or enjoyable. The return is just not limited to money only. You likely want to get most house for your money, by various metrics. I don't think that homelessness has much to do with construction costs: homeless people are usually not those who have $70k lying around which is not sufficient even as an initial downpayment for a home. The lack of housing is real, but it's more about regulations which forbid to build "cramped", "ugly" houses or "slums", or anything at all near elite houses which may not go down in "value".
- Ensorceled 4y ago
  > ROI should absolutely be a part of calculation, else it would be easy to spend (even) more money on a home that's not desirable or enjoyable. ROI is being used in it's economics section, literally as return on investment. > I don't think that homelessness has much to do with construction costs No, but it does have to do with ROI, which you hand waved away above by redefining ROI to be non-financial rewards such as enjoyment. Housing as an investment has put housing out of reach of a increasing percentage of homeowners and raised rental rates. The least expensive rentals in my city are out of reach for those making minimum wage in my city.
  - adamhp 4y ago
    "Investment" in this context is personal investment as a primary residence. You seem to be purposefully missing the point or cherry picking a singular definition of the word. The OP is literally a book about how to build a good home for yourself that is affordable. I'm fairly certain 90% of the audience on HN understand the housing crisis that exists and no one here is arguing for more rent-seeking with this book.
    - Ensorceled 4y ago
      ROI: Return on investment (ROI) is a performance measure used to evaluate the efficiency or profitability of an investment or compare the efficiency of a number of different investments. What do you think it means? "Enjoyment of my property" is an important aspect of a Cost-Benefit Analysis but it's not ROI. Anyway, it a is a singular problem in an otherwise laudable process.
      - cantaloupe 4y ago
        Using that definition, “efficiency of an investment” is quite apt for the characteristics of a home which do not involve monetary return. In other words, I want as much X for every dollar I put in. X can be comfort, curb appeal, U-value, etc.
infecto 4y ago
I think in the context of this book its not so much ROI for an outside investor but ROI for the occupant owner and has nothing to do with homelessness. ROI is important to look at because sometimes the higher efficency upgrade does not have a good payback over its useful life.

nine_k 4y ago

ROI should absolutely be a part of calculation, else it would be easy to spend (even) more money on a home that's not desirable or enjoyable. The return is just not limited to money only. You likely want to get most house for your money, by various metrics. I don't think that homelessness has much to do with construction costs: homeless people are usually not those who have $70k lying around which is not sufficient even as an initial downpayment for a home. The lack of housing is real, but it's more about regulations which forbid to build "cramped", "ugly" houses or "slums", or anything at all near elite houses which may not go down in "value".

Ensorceled 4y ago
> ROI should absolutely be a part of calculation, else it would be easy to spend (even) more money on a home that's not desirable or enjoyable. ROI is being used in it's economics section, literally as return on investment. > I don't think that homelessness has much to do with construction costs No, but it does have to do with ROI, which you hand waved away above by redefining ROI to be non-financial rewards such as enjoyment. Housing as an investment has put housing out of reach of a increasing percentage of homeowners and raised rental rates. The least expensive rentals in my city are out of reach for those making minimum wage in my city.
- adamhp 4y ago
  "Investment" in this context is personal investment as a primary residence. You seem to be purposefully missing the point or cherry picking a singular definition of the word. The OP is literally a book about how to build a good home for yourself that is affordable. I'm fairly certain 90% of the audience on HN understand the housing crisis that exists and no one here is arguing for more rent-seeking with this book.
  - Ensorceled 4y ago
    ROI: Return on investment (ROI) is a performance measure used to evaluate the efficiency or profitability of an investment or compare the efficiency of a number of different investments. What do you think it means? "Enjoyment of my property" is an important aspect of a Cost-Benefit Analysis but it's not ROI. Anyway, it a is a singular problem in an otherwise laudable process.
    - cantaloupe 4y ago
      Using that definition, “efficiency of an investment” is quite apt for the characteristics of a home which do not involve monetary return. In other words, I want as much X for every dollar I put in. X can be comfort, curb appeal, U-value, etc.

infecto 4y ago

I think in the context of this book its not so much ROI for an outside investor but ROI for the occupant owner and has nothing to do with homelessness. ROI is important to look at because sometimes the higher efficency upgrade does not have a good payback over its useful life.