4 ms·

If I worked a blue-collar/service job, making 1/5th what I make as a SWE, having to commute, stand on my feet all day, deal with customers... I'd do drugs. Like

If I worked a blue-collar/service job, making 1/5th what I make as a SWE, having to commute, stand on my feet all day, deal with customers... I'd do drugs. Like I get it. I get why people do drugs. I get why people don't save money for retirement. Life sucks SO MUCH, that it's basically the daily $5 Starbucks drink or suicide. Make no mistake, for most people, life fucking sucks. Then some of you come into that Chipotle and cop an attitude because the cashier misheard you or they got your order wrong or whatever.

thowaway959125 4y ago
> Make no mistake, for most people, life fucking sucks. And for many, it's one small slip-up, poor choices, medical problems, etc. and they may have to look forward to these sorts of jobs ... potentially until they drop. I have no back-up plan, and ageism is a thing. I have to play this software engineering game for as long as I can to avoid the service sector when I'm older. And I have to play it very carefully. Right now I'm sitting pretty, good income, unlimited vacation, work from anywhere. A "dream" job. But for how much longer? Fingers crossed. I am not sure about turning to drugs, that would likely amplify the hell and make suicide even more of a viable option. It's a grim outlook, I try not to think about it.
- gymbeaux 4y ago
  Agism is a thing, in both directions. I believe I have been discriminated against for being the youngest person on the team (I often was until mid/late 20s). Definitely though it will become an issue later in life, though I have to wonder if agism really will be a problem for us, or if it will be that we simply quit the rat race of keeping up with the industry. I'm thinking about all the older developers/engineers I have worked with over the years, and they all had one thing in common- they did not or would not keep up with the industry. Some were working with System Z mainframe stuff, some were working with VB.NET, and most moved into management. Management is certainly one way you could save yourself from aging out (whether through agism or not keeping up).
ericmcer 4y ago
I mean I worked at Safeway, Trader Joe’s and a bunch of other terrible jobs from age 15-27. Low skill labor/service jobs are not bad at all when you don’t have much context. Sharing one bathroom with 4 roommates who party constantly would be a nightmare for me now, but as an 18 year old who it was a paradise. It’s all relative, and you are viewing their jobs through the lens of an engineer making 6 figures.
- gymbeaux 4y ago
  The "these are starter jobs!" argument is tired and invalid, because so many Americans north of 20 (30, even) are working those jobs. I almost want to say you should know I am not thinking about teenagers/college students in my previous comment.
  - ericmcer 4y ago
    I am just pointing out that it is all relative. My friend is a doctor who makes 500k+ and dropping to a lowly 120k would make him miserable. I also have friends who make 25/hr and are fairly content, they don't need drugs to fend off suicide like you implied. Someone wouldn't spend 30 years working retail in utter misery the entire time, these are intelligent people who have agency. I spent ten years working these jobs and the people who were there for life were relatively content.
    - gymbeaux 4y ago
      $25/hr isn't bad pay... Nobody at the local Chipotle is making $25/hr. That makes all the difference in the world, believe it or not. At $25/hr you and an SO also making $25 can buy a house, for example.

thowaway959125 4y ago

> Make no mistake, for most people, life fucking sucks. And for many, it's one small slip-up, poor choices, medical problems, etc. and they may have to look forward to these sorts of jobs ... potentially until they drop. I have no back-up plan, and ageism is a thing. I have to play this software engineering game for as long as I can to avoid the service sector when I'm older. And I have to play it very carefully. Right now I'm sitting pretty, good income, unlimited vacation, work from anywhere. A "dream" job. But for how much longer? Fingers crossed. I am not sure about turning to drugs, that would likely amplify the hell and make suicide even more of a viable option. It's a grim outlook, I try not to think about it.

gymbeaux 4y ago
Agism is a thing, in both directions. I believe I have been discriminated against for being the youngest person on the team (I often was until mid/late 20s). Definitely though it will become an issue later in life, though I have to wonder if agism really will be a problem for us, or if it will be that we simply quit the rat race of keeping up with the industry. I'm thinking about all the older developers/engineers I have worked with over the years, and they all had one thing in common- they did not or would not keep up with the industry. Some were working with System Z mainframe stuff, some were working with VB.NET, and most moved into management. Management is certainly one way you could save yourself from aging out (whether through agism or not keeping up).

ericmcer 4y ago

I mean I worked at Safeway, Trader Joe’s and a bunch of other terrible jobs from age 15-27. Low skill labor/service jobs are not bad at all when you don’t have much context. Sharing one bathroom with 4 roommates who party constantly would be a nightmare for me now, but as an 18 year old who it was a paradise. It’s all relative, and you are viewing their jobs through the lens of an engineer making 6 figures.

gymbeaux 4y ago
The "these are starter jobs!" argument is tired and invalid, because so many Americans north of 20 (30, even) are working those jobs. I almost want to say you should know I am not thinking about teenagers/college students in my previous comment.
- ericmcer 4y ago
  I am just pointing out that it is all relative. My friend is a doctor who makes 500k+ and dropping to a lowly 120k would make him miserable. I also have friends who make 25/hr and are fairly content, they don't need drugs to fend off suicide like you implied. Someone wouldn't spend 30 years working retail in utter misery the entire time, these are intelligent people who have agency. I spent ten years working these jobs and the people who were there for life were relatively content.
  - gymbeaux 4y ago
    $25/hr isn't bad pay... Nobody at the local Chipotle is making $25/hr. That makes all the difference in the world, believe it or not. At $25/hr you and an SO also making $25 can buy a house, for example.