4 ms·

Islam brought the concept of "inalienable rights" to the West. The West still doesn't get it because in their system, emergency powers override every "inalienab

Islam brought the concept of "inalienable rights" to the West. The West still doesn't get it because in their system, emergency powers override every "inalienable right" the Westerners think they are entitled to.

blhblah12345 4y ago
I like to suck dick. If I get caught sucking dick in a Muslim country, I die. If I suck dick in the west, maybe I get my own dick sucked in return. Tell me again about the freedom of the islamic world.
- jacooper 4y ago
  Because the locals don't want to, and you know it. Ask anybody in the streets about their opinions of gays, and you shall get your answer. It may be fundamental freedom for you, but for them its an outrageous act that deserves punishment. Don't like it, don't stay there, simple.
  - blhblah12345 4y ago
    Meanwhile, Turkish men are the most metrosexual in the world, and let's just say it 's easier to get laid in Taksim than it is in the Castro. I feel that Istanbul is actually a far gayer city than San Francisco, but everybody stays in the closet in order to survive. You have a funny concept of free. If I am not free to be exactly who I am, then I am not free. If I am forced to follow a religion under penalty of death, I am not free. If I am forced to not leave that religion under penalty of death, I am not free. If I am forced to be straight, I am not free. A free nation allows everybody to be free, not just the mainstream.
    - jacooper 4y ago
      Then don't. The entire point of democracy is it allows commoners to decide regulation, and you bet that if there was ever a true democracy in the Arab world, gays won't be welcome in it either.
    - alephnerd 4y ago
      I've heard that from a couple Gay friends actually. They've had a better time in Istanbul's GLBT scene than in the US (though they are Latino in origin and I've heard American Gay culture has a bit of a race problem)
- AndrewUnmuted 4y ago
  [dead]
- tarotuser 4y ago
  Try being a bisexual occultist anywhere Islam entrenched itself in government. I might as well commit suicide if I have to go there. If they find out, I would be stoned probably immediately. Or, I've got a collection of pictures of what they do using knives - "Et tu Brute" style. I would consider going to a Sufi controlled area. At least they have some semblance of sense.
  - blhblah12345 4y ago
    Sufis are still fairly right-wing, except maybe the hippy westerners who go spin themselves doing the semih in the unofficial mevlevi lodges in Yelova or Konya. I've done the one in Konya actually, it's a great musical experience.
- pessimizer 4y ago
  Is this a joke, or do you not know that Lawrence v. Texas is from 2003? I've got jeans older than the inalienable right to suck dick in the US.
  - blhblah12345 4y ago
    Please, citation needed about the last time a western government stoned, beheaded, or hung to death a gay man for sucking dick?
    - nebulousthree 4y ago
      Nazis happened less than 100 years ago and they notably targeted homosexuals.
      - pc86 4y ago
        Most people who were old enough to fight in WWII are in wheelchairs or nursing homes now. Hardly comparable to Islamic regimes stoning homosexuals now.
- CyanBird 4y ago
  >freedom Parent comment did not use this word Don't be an asshole
npteljes 4y ago
>Islam brought the concept of "inalienable rights" to the West. Could you please elaborate on this? In my understanding, inalienable, or natural rights are of ancient Greek origin. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_rights_and_legal_rights https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_rights_and_legal_right...
- tboyd47 4y ago
  Who brought these ancient Greek ideas to Western Europe? Islam still grants inalienable rights to people that are almost lost in the West. For example: the inalienable right to privacy. Spying on people in their homes is strictly forbidden in Shari'ah, regardless of whether it's the government doing it or anyone. This concept was unheard of in Western Europe until Islam came. Also, the idea of war crimes. Western Europeans believed that war justifies any and all cruelty to the enemy. The West still believes that, actually, even if they have signed treaties, you can see it in their actions (Libya Iraq, etc.). They learned the idea of wartime ethics through contact with the Muslims during the Crusades. Belief in equality of opportunity is also Islamic in nature. The Greeks didn't even believe that. Aristotle and other Greek philosophers held that certain races of people were just born for slavery. This is what inspired the Christians to start the triangular slave trade and establish the race-based caste system in the Americas. When I study European history, it makes me realize that the Dark Age was not a pause in European history like we thought, but a reset. That's because the population of Europe had been almost completely replaced. And there were many other resets before and after that one. Europe was constantly being overrun and devastated over the centuries. So those new people (Goths, Huns, Norse, etc.) who came in were not literate people, but just going off of their own traditions and whatever they learned by way of contact with their nearest neighbor civilization, who in the Age of Exploration, happened to be Muslim. One of the cornerstones of Scythian and German civilization was this idea of dual rule, where you have one rule for war and one rule for peace. I believe this transformed into the idea of emergency powers in Western civilization. So all the freedoms you think you have are just conditional on whether or not the rulers deem it necessary to override them. An Islamic government is severely restricted from doing most of the oppressive acts we take for granted our states will do in the West (like levying high taxes, restricting commerce, etc.), in both war and peace. If a ruler came with an idea like eminent domain, he was challenged and stopped by the scholars of Shari'ah (talking about pre-colonial times). In the West, no one challenges eminent domain. I was looking at the sibling subthread and can tell it's a morass, but I'll just say this. Emergency powers override all freedoms. And under majority rule, minorities often do not have any way to ensure their rights will be respected by the majority.

blhblah12345 4y ago

I like to suck dick. If I get caught sucking dick in a Muslim country, I die. If I suck dick in the west, maybe I get my own dick sucked in return. Tell me again about the freedom of the islamic world.

jacooper 4y ago
Because the locals don't want to, and you know it. Ask anybody in the streets about their opinions of gays, and you shall get your answer. It may be fundamental freedom for you, but for them its an outrageous act that deserves punishment. Don't like it, don't stay there, simple.
- blhblah12345 4y ago
  Meanwhile, Turkish men are the most metrosexual in the world, and let's just say it 's easier to get laid in Taksim than it is in the Castro. I feel that Istanbul is actually a far gayer city than San Francisco, but everybody stays in the closet in order to survive. You have a funny concept of free. If I am not free to be exactly who I am, then I am not free. If I am forced to follow a religion under penalty of death, I am not free. If I am forced to not leave that religion under penalty of death, I am not free. If I am forced to be straight, I am not free. A free nation allows everybody to be free, not just the mainstream.
  - jacooper 4y ago
    Then don't. The entire point of democracy is it allows commoners to decide regulation, and you bet that if there was ever a true democracy in the Arab world, gays won't be welcome in it either.
  - alephnerd 4y ago
    I've heard that from a couple Gay friends actually. They've had a better time in Istanbul's GLBT scene than in the US (though they are Latino in origin and I've heard American Gay culture has a bit of a race problem)
AndrewUnmuted 4y ago
[dead]
tarotuser 4y ago
Try being a bisexual occultist anywhere Islam entrenched itself in government. I might as well commit suicide if I have to go there. If they find out, I would be stoned probably immediately. Or, I've got a collection of pictures of what they do using knives - "Et tu Brute" style. I would consider going to a Sufi controlled area. At least they have some semblance of sense.
- blhblah12345 4y ago
  Sufis are still fairly right-wing, except maybe the hippy westerners who go spin themselves doing the semih in the unofficial mevlevi lodges in Yelova or Konya. I've done the one in Konya actually, it's a great musical experience.
pessimizer 4y ago
Is this a joke, or do you not know that Lawrence v. Texas is from 2003? I've got jeans older than the inalienable right to suck dick in the US.
- blhblah12345 4y ago
  Please, citation needed about the last time a western government stoned, beheaded, or hung to death a gay man for sucking dick?
  - nebulousthree 4y ago
    Nazis happened less than 100 years ago and they notably targeted homosexuals.
    - pc86 4y ago
      Most people who were old enough to fight in WWII are in wheelchairs or nursing homes now. Hardly comparable to Islamic regimes stoning homosexuals now.
CyanBird 4y ago
>freedom Parent comment did not use this word Don't be an asshole

npteljes 4y ago

>Islam brought the concept of "inalienable rights" to the West. Could you please elaborate on this? In my understanding, inalienable, or natural rights are of ancient Greek origin. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_rights_and_legal_rights https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_rights_and_legal_right...

tboyd47 4y ago
Who brought these ancient Greek ideas to Western Europe? Islam still grants inalienable rights to people that are almost lost in the West. For example: the inalienable right to privacy. Spying on people in their homes is strictly forbidden in Shari'ah, regardless of whether it's the government doing it or anyone. This concept was unheard of in Western Europe until Islam came. Also, the idea of war crimes. Western Europeans believed that war justifies any and all cruelty to the enemy. The West still believes that, actually, even if they have signed treaties, you can see it in their actions (Libya Iraq, etc.). They learned the idea of wartime ethics through contact with the Muslims during the Crusades. Belief in equality of opportunity is also Islamic in nature. The Greeks didn't even believe that. Aristotle and other Greek philosophers held that certain races of people were just born for slavery. This is what inspired the Christians to start the triangular slave trade and establish the race-based caste system in the Americas. When I study European history, it makes me realize that the Dark Age was not a pause in European history like we thought, but a reset. That's because the population of Europe had been almost completely replaced. And there were many other resets before and after that one. Europe was constantly being overrun and devastated over the centuries. So those new people (Goths, Huns, Norse, etc.) who came in were not literate people, but just going off of their own traditions and whatever they learned by way of contact with their nearest neighbor civilization, who in the Age of Exploration, happened to be Muslim. One of the cornerstones of Scythian and German civilization was this idea of dual rule, where you have one rule for war and one rule for peace. I believe this transformed into the idea of emergency powers in Western civilization. So all the freedoms you think you have are just conditional on whether or not the rulers deem it necessary to override them. An Islamic government is severely restricted from doing most of the oppressive acts we take for granted our states will do in the West (like levying high taxes, restricting commerce, etc.), in both war and peace. If a ruler came with an idea like eminent domain, he was challenged and stopped by the scholars of Shari'ah (talking about pre-colonial times). In the West, no one challenges eminent domain. I was looking at the sibling subthread and can tell it's a morass, but I'll just say this. Emergency powers override all freedoms. And under majority rule, minorities often do not have any way to ensure their rights will be respected by the majority.