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> The more you were snubbed while poor, the more you enjoy displaying your wealth. Man I dunno about this. It does seem like a thing for certain personality ty

> The more you were snubbed while poor, the more you enjoy displaying your wealth. Man I dunno about this. It does seem like a thing for certain personality types, but I usually see exactly the opposite. All of the people I know who have "made it" from a less wealthy background are the opposite, living with a ton of guilt about their new wealth. I think this is because of having tons of family and friends still scraping by. It is very unseemly to be flamboyantly wealthy when everyone from your past is struggling. Maybe there is another inflection point of wealth, further down the road than the circles I run in, where you can afford to pull everyone else up too. But I'm pretty skeptical of that too. Something that has frustrated me to no end as I've started making good money is that I can't use any of it to improve the lives of people I actually know. They aren't going to take my money! They're doing just fine thank you very much. Even broaching the subject could ruin a relationship.

unity1001 4y ago
This is something that is valid more for societies like US, where being rich is seen as proof of 'hard work' and 'making it'. It defines your social status and actual social worth, therefore not being rich is like a stain. Its even built-into the terms used for describing it - someone's 'net worth'. As if a human being can be qualified by the amount of imaginary numbers attached to his or her social identity. So becoming rich from poor gives a proof of 'making it' and therefore being a 'valued member' of the society who does not 'laze around' but 'works hard'. Its early Puritan Christian belief repurposed as a social norm, really.
- sanderjd 4y ago
  I live in the US, and as I said, this is not my experience at all.
  - unity1001 4y ago
    Individuals' personal experiences being to the contrary does not mean that something is not a societal paradigm. From the cover of Forbes to the arguments used in discussions during lawmaking, the situation is as my comment described.
    - sanderjd 4y ago
      Your comments are also just anecdotes, except that they are second-order, based on your anecdotal impression of what you've read. From my experiences living within it, I don't think US society is actually the way you have become convinced it is from your experiences reading and watching things about it. Both of our beliefs are just anecdotal experiences. We could get closer to the truth with a bunch of sociology and anthropology, but financially there is no randomized controlled trial for this kind of question.
      - unity1001 4y ago
        > Your comments are also just anecdotes, except that they are second-order, based on your anecdotal impression of what you've read I really doubt that the Randian philosophy that took over the US since Reagan is 'just anecdotes'...
        sanderjd 4y ago
        Randian philosophy has not taken over the US since Reagan. You seem to have read or watched things that have convinced you of this false thing; those are the anecdotes I'm talking about. Elsewhere, I have conversations just like this with people who are certain that Marxism has taken over the US. They're in a "look at these examples of Marxism" bubble just like you're in a "look at these examples of Randian philosophy" bubble. The truth is that you're both wrong and the reality is a lot more complex (and a lot more interesting).
      - sanderjd 4y ago
        Just realized I typo'd "financially" instead of "fundamentally", but too late to edit now.
TeMPOraL 4y ago
> Something that has frustrated me to no end as I've started making good money is that I can't use any of it to improve the lives of people I actually know. They aren't going to take my money! They're doing just fine thank you very much. Even broaching the subject could ruin a relationship. There was a period when we had this "dance" with part of my family, who had a rougher patch financially, but tried not to show it. We'd occasionally help them out with shopping (as they didn't have a car, but we did), and always conveniently "forgot" to take money from them, or "accidentally" mixed their and ours grocery so we had to pay for both, and the receipt would "somehow" get "misplaced" along the way. I think both sides knew what's going on, but neither wanted to talk about it directly. But I guess it's better to maneuver around feelings of pride like this, than having to defend yourself from family members and "friends" who do want your money, quite actively, as I hear is a common problem faced by those who get a windfall.
- thwarted 4y ago
  The 80s Disney movie "Lots of Luck" is about what you describe in your last paragraph, and I'm willing to say that watching this movie as a kid probably influenced my style of money management.
mensetmanusman 4y ago
Something our family does is to purchase things for the good of helping others. E.g. buy a trailer/truck that others are free to use to move stuff, this can save hundreds of dollars. Broach the topic of getting rid of appliances you are ‘upgrading’ and asking if they would want the old ones, etc.
Red_Leaves_Flyy 4y ago
>They aren't going to take my money! Hey! It’s me your friend. Seriously though. They’re probably not that bad off, or the next most important lesson for them to learn is to take help when it’s offered.
- sanderjd 4y ago
  No that's right, they aren't "that bad off". But just to give a concrete example, I have a number of loved ones who have been unable to afford a house, much longer than they would have liked. And I can't help them with that. I'm sure I could help if they were starving or homeless, you're right.

unity1001 4y ago

This is something that is valid more for societies like US, where being rich is seen as proof of 'hard work' and 'making it'. It defines your social status and actual social worth, therefore not being rich is like a stain. Its even built-into the terms used for describing it - someone's 'net worth'. As if a human being can be qualified by the amount of imaginary numbers attached to his or her social identity. So becoming rich from poor gives a proof of 'making it' and therefore being a 'valued member' of the society who does not 'laze around' but 'works hard'. Its early Puritan Christian belief repurposed as a social norm, really.

sanderjd 4y ago
I live in the US, and as I said, this is not my experience at all.
- unity1001 4y ago
  Individuals' personal experiences being to the contrary does not mean that something is not a societal paradigm. From the cover of Forbes to the arguments used in discussions during lawmaking, the situation is as my comment described.
  - sanderjd 4y ago
    Your comments are also just anecdotes, except that they are second-order, based on your anecdotal impression of what you've read. From my experiences living within it, I don't think US society is actually the way you have become convinced it is from your experiences reading and watching things about it. Both of our beliefs are just anecdotal experiences. We could get closer to the truth with a bunch of sociology and anthropology, but financially there is no randomized controlled trial for this kind of question.
    - unity1001 4y ago
      > Your comments are also just anecdotes, except that they are second-order, based on your anecdotal impression of what you've read I really doubt that the Randian philosophy that took over the US since Reagan is 'just anecdotes'...
      - sanderjd 4y ago
        Randian philosophy has not taken over the US since Reagan. You seem to have read or watched things that have convinced you of this false thing; those are the anecdotes I'm talking about. Elsewhere, I have conversations just like this with people who are certain that Marxism has taken over the US. They're in a "look at these examples of Marxism" bubble just like you're in a "look at these examples of Randian philosophy" bubble. The truth is that you're both wrong and the reality is a lot more complex (and a lot more interesting).
    - sanderjd 4y ago
      Just realized I typo'd "financially" instead of "fundamentally", but too late to edit now.

TeMPOraL 4y ago

> Something that has frustrated me to no end as I've started making good money is that I can't use any of it to improve the lives of people I actually know. They aren't going to take my money! They're doing just fine thank you very much. Even broaching the subject could ruin a relationship. There was a period when we had this "dance" with part of my family, who had a rougher patch financially, but tried not to show it. We'd occasionally help them out with shopping (as they didn't have a car, but we did), and always conveniently "forgot" to take money from them, or "accidentally" mixed their and ours grocery so we had to pay for both, and the receipt would "somehow" get "misplaced" along the way. I think both sides knew what's going on, but neither wanted to talk about it directly. But I guess it's better to maneuver around feelings of pride like this, than having to defend yourself from family members and "friends" who do want your money, quite actively, as I hear is a common problem faced by those who get a windfall.

thwarted 4y ago
The 80s Disney movie "Lots of Luck" is about what you describe in your last paragraph, and I'm willing to say that watching this movie as a kid probably influenced my style of money management.

mensetmanusman 4y ago

Something our family does is to purchase things for the good of helping others. E.g. buy a trailer/truck that others are free to use to move stuff, this can save hundreds of dollars. Broach the topic of getting rid of appliances you are ‘upgrading’ and asking if they would want the old ones, etc.

Red_Leaves_Flyy 4y ago

>They aren't going to take my money! Hey! It’s me your friend. Seriously though. They’re probably not that bad off, or the next most important lesson for them to learn is to take help when it’s offered.

sanderjd 4y ago
No that's right, they aren't "that bad off". But just to give a concrete example, I have a number of loved ones who have been unable to afford a house, much longer than they would have liked. And I can't help them with that. I'm sure I could help if they were starving or homeless, you're right.