3 ms·

Author first assumes that only 60% of the available battery capacity is used (80% > 20%) and then arrives at the conclusion that the range is lower than expecte

by manmal 4y ago

Author first assumes that only 60% of the available battery capacity is used (80% > 20%) and then arrives at the conclusion that the range is lower than expected. Well, no shit. I personally do charge my Ioniq BEV to 100%, and I often drive it to, say, 6%. In summer, I get a range of 220km, and in winter 160-180km, depending on temperature and number of cold starts (cold starts seem to trigger a battery warm-up). SOH is still at 100% after almost 3 years.

michpoch 4y ago
What do you do when you arrive at the charger with 6% battery left and the charger doesn’t work? Or if there’s a significant queue?
- sigio 4y ago
  Select charge-locations with 4+ chargers available, and in the larger charge-locations along motorway/freeway intersections, there's usually chargers from multiple networks/suppliers, so even failures on a backend of one provider can be worked around by using another network. Doing 2000km this week, I only encountered 1 case where I had to use the 50kw charger, as it was the only one available (there were 2 300kw chargers, 1 in use and 1 in maintenance-mode). Most charge-locations had 4+ available and unused stalls, with various locations having 10+ 150kw+ stations. Availability can be seen in many charge-apps miles before you get to the location, so if you see it at 75%+ capacity, select a different location.
  - TheLoafOfBread 4y ago
    This is a very nice theory. Does not work in practice. Got into France, north of Troyes in Enyaq, last 20km in battery. Only chargers there in 30km perimeter are Freshmile 22kW chargers, which won't charge my car (can't start session, car refuses charger, tested 3 of them). Was able to save myself in local PSA dealership, which got their own charger and gave me 20km more so I can get to Troyes to Ionity charger. What is extremely annoying is * This is a large network, yet not compatible and there is no way to figure that out. * The car was actually trying to lead me on those charger via its own internal navigation, so even somebody who was creating this map believed that those chargers are compatible, yet they aren't. * I could never get into such situation with gas. In the most extreme case, I could have just use funnel to get the gas into the tank if hose would not be compatible with my car. So the fact that there are chargers around you means nothing at all if you don't know if they are working and are compatible without your car.
    - manmal 4y ago
      Try the „A better route planner“ app if you haven’t. It should give you routes that have plenty of error margin.
- limitedsupply 4y ago
  Not OP and drive a Tesla. Charging stations are pretty large at least where I live. 10–15 chargers minimum and the Tesla nav system tells you in advance how many are available to use.
  - xwdv 4y ago
    [flagged]
    - monsieurbanana 4y ago
      Your car breaks. What. Do. You Do. The guy replying to you said it's a pretty unlikely situation, so you treat it the same as other unlikely, but always present, issues that your car might have. You accept his answer. Or you don't, and argue with him and say that you think he's wrong and it's going to happen too often, that's a fine reply too. Adding more punctuation doesn't help.
    - ceejayoz 4y ago
      How is there a queue for a broken charger? 6% is likely enough to get you to another charging site, or a regular outlet for a slower charge. I’d expect AAA-style roadside assistance to deal with these scenarios in the near future, as well.
    - toast0 4y ago
      I mean, you can't walk to the nearest working charger with a gas can, but if you have your level 1 charger with you, you can probably find an outlet nearby. Utility electricity is nearly ubiquitous along highways. Any sort of building near a highway is bound to have electric service; the question is if you can convince the occupants to let you charge for a couple hours. If there's a big queue, you just wait. Same as if there's a big queue at the fueling station.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - mensetmanusman 4y ago
      You shake your fists at the cloud… and wait your turn.
- turtlebits 4y ago
  Same thing as you do with a gas car and you can't get gas for any reason. Call AAA/roadside services?
- manmal 4y ago
  I just don’t. With 6% (sometimes less) I arrive only at home or at sites with multiple chargers. Apps in the EU can show operating status for individual points, but I‘ve stopped looking that up at some point.
- josephcsible 4y ago
  What do you do if your gas gauge is on E and the only gas station in the small town you're in is closed?
  - michpoch 4y ago
    I take a bus / hitchhike to the next petrol station and come back with a canister of fuel. It fortunately never happened to me personally. On top of that, the "E" will mean I still have around 100 kms of range, maybe more if I start driving slowly. 6% on EV is like, 20 kms?
pforret 4y ago
I see colleagues that have to choose a new EV and use the EPA rating as an actual distance ("Oh I can drive to Paris in 1 go"). They don't know that you normally don't start from 100%, and you don't go down to 0%. Your 94% range usage is impressive, but not the norm for daily usage. Most people follow their vendor's recommendations for battery longevity.
- davedx 4y ago
  When I drove from NL to Paris of course I charge to 100% first. There's some rational logic in the article and comments but there's also some nonsense.
  - pforret 4y ago
    My article talks about daily usage. For long distance travel, obviously I charge to higher % and I use Superchargers. Although even in those circumstances, I never reach 400km between charges, more like 300-350km. Never the ilusive 533 km.
    - manmal 4y ago
      Range depends on so many things - speed, acceleration, elevation, temperature (not only from heating/AC but there’s also increased drag in winter from air resistance), wind, precipitation, tire pressure, tire profile. You can try following trucks closely on highways, the reduced drag does wonders. If you have a Tesla, really watch that gas pedal. Strong acceleration is fun but super bad for range.
- tensor 4y ago
  Most people also don't drive 400km+ in "daily usage." When they do they charge to 100%. Just like in a gas car you don't fill the tank 100% every day. But you do before a long trip. Can you imagine the article "well acshually, your gas car daily range is much lower because you don't usually start with a full tank!"
  - manmal 4y ago

by manmal 4y ago

michpoch 4y ago

What do you do when you arrive at the charger with 6% battery left and the charger doesn’t work? Or if there’s a significant queue?

sigio 4y ago
Select charge-locations with 4+ chargers available, and in the larger charge-locations along motorway/freeway intersections, there's usually chargers from multiple networks/suppliers, so even failures on a backend of one provider can be worked around by using another network. Doing 2000km this week, I only encountered 1 case where I had to use the 50kw charger, as it was the only one available (there were 2 300kw chargers, 1 in use and 1 in maintenance-mode). Most charge-locations had 4+ available and unused stalls, with various locations having 10+ 150kw+ stations. Availability can be seen in many charge-apps miles before you get to the location, so if you see it at 75%+ capacity, select a different location.
- TheLoafOfBread 4y ago
  This is a very nice theory. Does not work in practice. Got into France, north of Troyes in Enyaq, last 20km in battery. Only chargers there in 30km perimeter are Freshmile 22kW chargers, which won't charge my car (can't start session, car refuses charger, tested 3 of them). Was able to save myself in local PSA dealership, which got their own charger and gave me 20km more so I can get to Troyes to Ionity charger. What is extremely annoying is * This is a large network, yet not compatible and there is no way to figure that out. * The car was actually trying to lead me on those charger via its own internal navigation, so even somebody who was creating this map believed that those chargers are compatible, yet they aren't. * I could never get into such situation with gas. In the most extreme case, I could have just use funnel to get the gas into the tank if hose would not be compatible with my car. So the fact that there are chargers around you means nothing at all if you don't know if they are working and are compatible without your car.
  - manmal 4y ago
    Try the „A better route planner“ app if you haven’t. It should give you routes that have plenty of error margin.
limitedsupply 4y ago
Not OP and drive a Tesla. Charging stations are pretty large at least where I live. 10–15 chargers minimum and the Tesla nav system tells you in advance how many are available to use.
- xwdv 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - monsieurbanana 4y ago
    Your car breaks. What. Do. You Do. The guy replying to you said it's a pretty unlikely situation, so you treat it the same as other unlikely, but always present, issues that your car might have. You accept his answer. Or you don't, and argue with him and say that you think he's wrong and it's going to happen too often, that's a fine reply too. Adding more punctuation doesn't help.
  - ceejayoz 4y ago
    How is there a queue for a broken charger? 6% is likely enough to get you to another charging site, or a regular outlet for a slower charge. I’d expect AAA-style roadside assistance to deal with these scenarios in the near future, as well.
  - toast0 4y ago
    I mean, you can't walk to the nearest working charger with a gas can, but if you have your level 1 charger with you, you can probably find an outlet nearby. Utility electricity is nearly ubiquitous along highways. Any sort of building near a highway is bound to have electric service; the question is if you can convince the occupants to let you charge for a couple hours. If there's a big queue, you just wait. Same as if there's a big queue at the fueling station.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - mensetmanusman 4y ago
    You shake your fists at the cloud… and wait your turn.
turtlebits 4y ago
Same thing as you do with a gas car and you can't get gas for any reason. Call AAA/roadside services?
manmal 4y ago
I just don’t. With 6% (sometimes less) I arrive only at home or at sites with multiple chargers. Apps in the EU can show operating status for individual points, but I‘ve stopped looking that up at some point.
josephcsible 4y ago
What do you do if your gas gauge is on E and the only gas station in the small town you're in is closed?
- michpoch 4y ago
  I take a bus / hitchhike to the next petrol station and come back with a canister of fuel. It fortunately never happened to me personally. On top of that, the "E" will mean I still have around 100 kms of range, maybe more if I start driving slowly. 6% on EV is like, 20 kms?

pforret 4y ago

I see colleagues that have to choose a new EV and use the EPA rating as an actual distance ("Oh I can drive to Paris in 1 go"). They don't know that you normally don't start from 100%, and you don't go down to 0%. Your 94% range usage is impressive, but not the norm for daily usage. Most people follow their vendor's recommendations for battery longevity.

davedx 4y ago
When I drove from NL to Paris of course I charge to 100% first. There's some rational logic in the article and comments but there's also some nonsense.
- pforret 4y ago
  My article talks about daily usage. For long distance travel, obviously I charge to higher % and I use Superchargers. Although even in those circumstances, I never reach 400km between charges, more like 300-350km. Never the ilusive 533 km.
  - manmal 4y ago
    Range depends on so many things - speed, acceleration, elevation, temperature (not only from heating/AC but there’s also increased drag in winter from air resistance), wind, precipitation, tire pressure, tire profile. You can try following trucks closely on highways, the reduced drag does wonders. If you have a Tesla, really watch that gas pedal. Strong acceleration is fun but super bad for range.
tensor 4y ago
Most people also don't drive 400km+ in "daily usage." When they do they charge to 100%. Just like in a gas car you don't fill the tank 100% every day. But you do before a long trip. Can you imagine the article "well acshually, your gas car daily range is much lower because you don't usually start with a full tank!"
- manmal 4y ago