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> You pay for a service where the amount you pay far outweighs the value of the service, by orders of magnitude. This is allowed because the amount is often obs

> You pay for a service where the amount you pay far outweighs the value of the service, by orders of magnitude. This is allowed because the amount is often obscured and deferred from the customer. The student is allowed to make this choice because they’re an “adult” and it serves the interests of the school. The amount you pay is obscured, but generally to the student's benefit, not detriment. 75% of students attend public schools, mostly in-state. Few students pay the nameplate tuition described in the media. Net tuition actually paid is much lower, and has been largely flat over the past 5 years. Some useful data points from here https://research.collegeboard.org/trends/college-pricing/highlights https://research.collegeboard.org/trends/college-pricing/hig...: > The majority of full-time undergraduate students receive grant aid that helps them pay for college. > Since 2016-17, the average net tuition and fee price paid by first-time full-time in-state students enrolled at public four-year institutions has been declining after adjusting for inflation; it was an estimated $2,250 in 2022-23.

dimmke 4y ago
Just to make people aware, Collegeboard is one of the companies that depends on and fosters the "high education industry" to exist. They create and administer the SATs, which students have to pay a fee to take, and that test is a requirement to apply for admission at most U.S. universities. They also sell all of the data they acquire from students forced to take this test to colleges and universities. This is another example of how rotten and corrupt the industry is - they have an incentive to make college seem affordable and any of their sponsored research should automatically be taken with a grain of salt. The author of the parent comment likely knew some or all of this and chose not to disclose it when posting "statistics" I just used the "Net Price Calculator" from Georgia Tech where I said I'd be living with my parents (so no room and board cost) and eligible for in state tuition and their calculator for a year of in state tuition came out to almost $20,000: https://imgur.com/a/BrsfVXV https://imgur.com/a/BrsfVXV
- secabeen 4y ago
  College board is involved, sure. However, they are the clearest comprehensive data source I know of on the cost of college net of aid. Do you have other data sources beyond a single data point? The only fully non-biased data points I know of are from the US Education department. Their data shows that tuition and fees average across all 4-year public schools is ~$10,000/yr. The $2,500/yr number I quoted is for first-time attendees, who may get more grants and financial aid. As a comparison, the annual tuition at 2-year schools does average only $2,500/yr, and is a common path for students who then transfer to 4-year schools. https://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d21/tables/dt21_333.10.asp?current=yes https://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d21/tables/dt21_333.10.a... The ed.gov data also clearly shows the root problem, disinvestment in state schools by state legislatures. In 2007-08, states spent $11,049 per student, and tuition averaged $8,314. By 2016, state allocations were down to $8,218, and tuition was up to $10,526. Q.E.D. In the images you linked, tuition is $12k, not $20k. The latter number includes transportation, personal expenses, and other items.
  - dimmke 4y ago
    I could probably find more data - but I didn't feel like spending multiple hours on a Sunday building an argument against you that barely anybody would read. You act like me posting one example is just some fluke anecdata. I only had to pull up one university I know of in my home state and use their own calculator to prove you are wrong. >In the images you linked, tuition is $12k, not $20k. 1. 12k/year is 5x more than the "average" you quoted. But you don't acknowledge that in your comment at all. 2. College always has other non optional expenses than class tuition. That's why it's included in a calculator by a college. You mentioned "personal expenses" and "transportation" to downplay it. Other compulsory line items for going to college in the U.S.: - Textbooks - that are obscenely overpriced. - Parking. You have to pay for a pass if you're not living in the dorms. - Meal plans. In many cases, you have to buy a meal plan that is several thousand dollars if you are a freshman even if you live off campus. Your argument is like buying a car from a dealership and saying "I only paid 15k. Yeah, there was a $2000 'Paperwork fee' and a $1500 'Document fee' but the actual car was only 15k!" You're being disingenuous. I implied it in my previous comment but now I'm stating it outright.

dimmke 4y ago

Just to make people aware, Collegeboard is one of the companies that depends on and fosters the "high education industry" to exist. They create and administer the SATs, which students have to pay a fee to take, and that test is a requirement to apply for admission at most U.S. universities. They also sell all of the data they acquire from students forced to take this test to colleges and universities. This is another example of how rotten and corrupt the industry is - they have an incentive to make college seem affordable and any of their sponsored research should automatically be taken with a grain of salt. The author of the parent comment likely knew some or all of this and chose not to disclose it when posting "statistics" I just used the "Net Price Calculator" from Georgia Tech where I said I'd be living with my parents (so no room and board cost) and eligible for in state tuition and their calculator for a year of in state tuition came out to almost $20,000: https://imgur.com/a/BrsfVXV https://imgur.com/a/BrsfVXV

secabeen 4y ago
College board is involved, sure. However, they are the clearest comprehensive data source I know of on the cost of college net of aid. Do you have other data sources beyond a single data point? The only fully non-biased data points I know of are from the US Education department. Their data shows that tuition and fees average across all 4-year public schools is ~$10,000/yr. The $2,500/yr number I quoted is for first-time attendees, who may get more grants and financial aid. As a comparison, the annual tuition at 2-year schools does average only $2,500/yr, and is a common path for students who then transfer to 4-year schools. https://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d21/tables/dt21_333.10.asp?current=yes https://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d21/tables/dt21_333.10.a... The ed.gov data also clearly shows the root problem, disinvestment in state schools by state legislatures. In 2007-08, states spent $11,049 per student, and tuition averaged $8,314. By 2016, state allocations were down to $8,218, and tuition was up to $10,526. Q.E.D. In the images you linked, tuition is $12k, not $20k. The latter number includes transportation, personal expenses, and other items.
- dimmke 4y ago
  I could probably find more data - but I didn't feel like spending multiple hours on a Sunday building an argument against you that barely anybody would read. You act like me posting one example is just some fluke anecdata. I only had to pull up one university I know of in my home state and use their own calculator to prove you are wrong. >In the images you linked, tuition is $12k, not $20k. 1. 12k/year is 5x more than the "average" you quoted. But you don't acknowledge that in your comment at all. 2. College always has other non optional expenses than class tuition. That's why it's included in a calculator by a college. You mentioned "personal expenses" and "transportation" to downplay it. Other compulsory line items for going to college in the U.S.: - Textbooks - that are obscenely overpriced. - Parking. You have to pay for a pass if you're not living in the dorms. - Meal plans. In many cases, you have to buy a meal plan that is several thousand dollars if you are a freshman even if you live off campus. Your argument is like buying a car from a dealership and saying "I only paid 15k. Yeah, there was a $2000 'Paperwork fee' and a $1500 'Document fee' but the actual car was only 15k!" You're being disingenuous. I implied it in my previous comment but now I'm stating it outright.