3 ms·

Sure, but again, you're living off of your neighbors if you don't contribute. It's more efficient over all, but you still need X amount of energy to heat all fl

Sure, but again, you're living off of your neighbors if you don't contribute. It's more efficient over all, but you still need X amount of energy to heat all flats to Y°C. You can shut off your heater, your neighbors have to heat a little more because some heat will escape to your flat, and you don't have to pay and still get the heat. It's the same amount in total, just divided through fewer parties.

throw__away7391 4y ago
No it's not, because you're sharing walls, significantly reducing the surface area exposed to the cold.
- tptacek 4y ago
  I think this thread is arguing at cross purposes. I read the parent commenter to be making a narrow claim: that the author can't really claim to be disconnected from the grid, because they're relying on the connections of other people for basic things like heating. That seems true, even though the experiment is still interesting and valid in its own right.
lukeschlather 4y ago
It's not quite that simple. If everyone was being parsimonious with heat, yes. But I tend to turn my heat down to 50 at night and 65 during the day and if all my neighbors do 60 at night - 70 in the day, then on many days I can't really cool my apartment to 50 just because of their waste heat. And in colder damper climates I do this intentionally to help inhibit mold growth etc. so am I free riding or are my neighbors causing my apartment to overheat?
- luckylion 4y ago
  I'm sure it gets fuzzy on the edges, but "I don't heat and it's still warm" isn't in that zone. What I'm talking about is: given you want ~18°c/60°f in rooms on average (20°c/68°f for more comfort), and you have a fixed volume of space inside a building, you're not magically saving energy by turning your heat down, because your neighbors need to turn theirs up to achieve the average temperature because insulation is mostly on the outside, not between flats. You could counteract that by insulating your rooms towards your neighbors, which would also achieve your goal of not going above 10°c/50°f.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]

throw__away7391 4y ago

No it's not, because you're sharing walls, significantly reducing the surface area exposed to the cold.

tptacek 4y ago
I think this thread is arguing at cross purposes. I read the parent commenter to be making a narrow claim: that the author can't really claim to be disconnected from the grid, because they're relying on the connections of other people for basic things like heating. That seems true, even though the experiment is still interesting and valid in its own right.

lukeschlather 4y ago

It's not quite that simple. If everyone was being parsimonious with heat, yes. But I tend to turn my heat down to 50 at night and 65 during the day and if all my neighbors do 60 at night - 70 in the day, then on many days I can't really cool my apartment to 50 just because of their waste heat. And in colder damper climates I do this intentionally to help inhibit mold growth etc. so am I free riding or are my neighbors causing my apartment to overheat?

luckylion 4y ago
I'm sure it gets fuzzy on the edges, but "I don't heat and it's still warm" isn't in that zone. What I'm talking about is: given you want ~18°c/60°f in rooms on average (20°c/68°f for more comfort), and you have a fixed volume of space inside a building, you're not magically saving energy by turning your heat down, because your neighbors need to turn theirs up to achieve the average temperature because insulation is mostly on the outside, not between flats. You could counteract that by insulating your rooms towards your neighbors, which would also achieve your goal of not going above 10°c/50°f.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]