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> I don’t know why anyone would want that. A calendar app, a messaging app, etc. All sort of apps have reasonable use cases for notifications, and now you can

> I don’t know why anyone would want that. A calendar app, a messaging app, etc. All sort of apps have reasonable use cases for notifications, and now you can write those apps as persistent web apps on iOS. The user should still have control over notifications of course, and if you're downloading, let's say, a shopping app, no reason to allow notifications, it'll just be ads or whatever. Overall, flexibility is good.

olliej 4y ago
Happily good calendaring apps have a standard protocol to communicate with calendar apps that don’t load a ton of Facebook and Google stalkerware every time you load them, and let their users just use their prefer calendar app. Messaging services can also make an app, because I sure as shit don’t want my entire browser to become more annoying just because someone can’t be assed making an app. Hopefully safari will gate this BS on making a home screen app rather than just making every site a beacon of “add notifications so that we can sell you to advertisers even when you aren’t on our site!”
- CGamesPlay 4y ago
  My favorite calendar app is a PWA that uses those standard protocols to integrate with services, plus some other features that I want. And soon, it will have notifications, too. > Overall, flexibility is good.
  - olliej 4y ago
    Ah, see I prefer not to have my personal data proliferated to a bunch of additional companies that want to monetize my data, and I like my use of such apps to not include spyware linking that to all the trackers on the web. It would seem we're unlikely to agree on the value proposition of notifications from random websites. My assumption is that I'll see a bunch of BS "get notifications" spam from a variety of sites, none of which have any reason to justify the spam. Just as happened with the first version of "let's give websites the ability to spam users. Surely that won't be abused" notification system.
dontlaugh 4y ago
Is it really worth it, when there are so many good native apps instead? Personally I don’t really see the point.
- jsnell 4y ago
  One point is to not allow Apple to act as the gatekeeper to what applications can be implemented and used on iOS. A second is to not force implementors of a fundamentally cross-platform application where I care about the service rather than the technology stack to waste huge amounts of resources on reimplementing the app multiple times. A third is having the economic gains of the app go to the people who actually did the work, not to the middleman who has been resting on their laurels for 15 years, collecting their 30%. Native apps are good for Apple, web apps are bad for them. They've been using their full control of one of the world's most important computing platforms to cripple the web platform. If web apps really were that unappeling to users and developers, they wouldn't need to worry. Just stop the obstructions, and the market would decide in the favor of native apps. That they've been fighting this tooth and nail tells you that they have no confidence. And let's be clear, Apple never even needed to do the work themselves. They just needed to stop blocking competing browsers. Again, if notifications are so bad, surely the users would have staid in Apple's no-notification garden rather than ship to a browser with that feature. But again, they have no confidence in their users actually choosing Safari.

olliej 4y ago

Happily good calendaring apps have a standard protocol to communicate with calendar apps that don’t load a ton of Facebook and Google stalkerware every time you load them, and let their users just use their prefer calendar app. Messaging services can also make an app, because I sure as shit don’t want my entire browser to become more annoying just because someone can’t be assed making an app. Hopefully safari will gate this BS on making a home screen app rather than just making every site a beacon of “add notifications so that we can sell you to advertisers even when you aren’t on our site!”

CGamesPlay 4y ago
My favorite calendar app is a PWA that uses those standard protocols to integrate with services, plus some other features that I want. And soon, it will have notifications, too. > Overall, flexibility is good.
- olliej 4y ago
  Ah, see I prefer not to have my personal data proliferated to a bunch of additional companies that want to monetize my data, and I like my use of such apps to not include spyware linking that to all the trackers on the web. It would seem we're unlikely to agree on the value proposition of notifications from random websites. My assumption is that I'll see a bunch of BS "get notifications" spam from a variety of sites, none of which have any reason to justify the spam. Just as happened with the first version of "let's give websites the ability to spam users. Surely that won't be abused" notification system.

dontlaugh 4y ago

Is it really worth it, when there are so many good native apps instead? Personally I don’t really see the point.

jsnell 4y ago
One point is to not allow Apple to act as the gatekeeper to what applications can be implemented and used on iOS. A second is to not force implementors of a fundamentally cross-platform application where I care about the service rather than the technology stack to waste huge amounts of resources on reimplementing the app multiple times. A third is having the economic gains of the app go to the people who actually did the work, not to the middleman who has been resting on their laurels for 15 years, collecting their 30%. Native apps are good for Apple, web apps are bad for them. They've been using their full control of one of the world's most important computing platforms to cripple the web platform. If web apps really were that unappeling to users and developers, they wouldn't need to worry. Just stop the obstructions, and the market would decide in the favor of native apps. That they've been fighting this tooth and nail tells you that they have no confidence. And let's be clear, Apple never even needed to do the work themselves. They just needed to stop blocking competing browsers. Again, if notifications are so bad, surely the users would have staid in Apple's no-notification garden rather than ship to a browser with that feature. But again, they have no confidence in their users actually choosing Safari.