3 ms·

"Unlimited time off" is quite the spin on what is better termed "discretionary time off." Under traditional PTO arrangements, your PTO is an entitlement. You a

"Unlimited time off" is quite the spin on what is better termed "discretionary time off." Under traditional PTO arrangements, your PTO is an entitlement. You are owed it; it is part of your compensation. Under "unlimited time off," your vacation is subject to the discretion of your boss. But wait!, you say. Traditional PTO was subject to your boss's discretion as well! Not quite. The scheduling was subject to mission requirements. The entitlement, however, was not. If your boss never let you take your vacation days, they had to pay it out to you. That's no longer true.

granshaw 4y ago
Not only that, I believe it’s an extremely bad look if they never let you take your full entitlement for the year, after some back and forth on the scheduling part
- torstenvl 4y ago
  Absolutely. Under Traditional PTO, PTO that isn't taken becomes a payroll line item that is measured and accounted for. Under Unlimited PTO, no such metric exists. I believe we all know what happens in large organizations with regard to the priorities given to things with metrics versus things without metrics?
- wkat4242 4y ago
  It's also illegal to refuse it in some European countries. A company may refuse certain dates but the employee must be allowed to take the holidays somewhere in the year and usually in one or more big blocks too.
dangus 4y ago
Another important detail: Microsoft doesn’t have to keep cash on hand set aside to pay out accrued vacation. I personally always liked “unlimited” time off, but I also recognize that I was a beneficiary of a highly unequal system. You have to be in a role that’s highly in-demand to truly leverage the benefit. I never felt like I couldn’t request time off because I knew nobody in their right mind would fire a decent performer in my field. That same concept doesn’t apply to the people in other areas like support or more junior roles, or just low performers in general. Your vacation benefit shouldn’t depend on your performance as taking time off is a proven performance enhancer. The only way I would advocate for unlimited time off is if it comes with a minimum usage guarantee/requirement.

granshaw 4y ago

Not only that, I believe it’s an extremely bad look if they never let you take your full entitlement for the year, after some back and forth on the scheduling part

torstenvl 4y ago
Absolutely. Under Traditional PTO, PTO that isn't taken becomes a payroll line item that is measured and accounted for. Under Unlimited PTO, no such metric exists. I believe we all know what happens in large organizations with regard to the priorities given to things with metrics versus things without metrics?
wkat4242 4y ago
It's also illegal to refuse it in some European countries. A company may refuse certain dates but the employee must be allowed to take the holidays somewhere in the year and usually in one or more big blocks too.

dangus 4y ago

Another important detail: Microsoft doesn’t have to keep cash on hand set aside to pay out accrued vacation. I personally always liked “unlimited” time off, but I also recognize that I was a beneficiary of a highly unequal system. You have to be in a role that’s highly in-demand to truly leverage the benefit. I never felt like I couldn’t request time off because I knew nobody in their right mind would fire a decent performer in my field. That same concept doesn’t apply to the people in other areas like support or more junior roles, or just low performers in general. Your vacation benefit shouldn’t depend on your performance as taking time off is a proven performance enhancer. The only way I would advocate for unlimited time off is if it comes with a minimum usage guarantee/requirement.