8 ms·

It's fucking wild that this guy keeps talking, because either we're watching this guy continue to incriminate himself in ways that are going to really hurt him

It's fucking wild that this guy keeps talking, because either we're watching this guy continue to incriminate himself in ways that are going to really hurt him a court of law, or he's actually going to get off lightly in which case his confidence is just disgusting. He genuinely thinks he can just continually say in front of everyone "These assets I just totally invented are worth billions" and no amount of argument affects him. And that he hasn't done anything wrong when we literally have testimony from his employees about exactly how stole the money. "If I just say illiquid enough, it'll all be ok". No. At some point this guy is going to be in a court and have to come up with a coherent answer why he's describing stuff he made up as illiquid billions, and it better be good. He simply doesn't have even a passing relationship with the truth. It just seems that at some point in the years of idiot VCs handing him money and servicing him orally, he started to actually believe he can just make up reality.

ulrashida 4y ago
Did you not see his two spreadsheets labelled "JUST AN ESTIMATE" that clearly show he is right? I would love to know the thought process behind his decision to make this post.
- SilverBirch 4y ago
  Presumably the thought process is something along the lines of "No one is going to look at this, only count the liquid stuff and make the very obvious point we were underwater even at the peak of the market".
breck 4y ago
[flagged]
- SilverBirch 4y ago
  God I wish someone would pay me for my HN comments.
- smcl 4y ago
  Which claims specifically need a citation?
  - breck 4y ago
    ' when we literally have testimony'
    - smcl 4y ago
      Hmm so "testimony" is a bit firm, maybe it's referring to something I haven't seen yet but I read that as referring to the backdoor: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6DezodR9hNI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6DezodR9hNI If it is the backdoor, then to be honest his own statements on it make him look more guilty of it than anything else. Here's a transcript from that interview: Tiffany Fong: There was something about a backdoor that allowed you to execute commands that could alter the companies financial records without alerting others. That this was put in place, I think that was a Reuters article which made it seem like you secretly were moving money in the background. SBF: Wait and this is something that I would be doing? TF: It kind of said that SBF put like a secret backdoor so that secretly he was moving funds to Alameda and it was undetected and that this was something that you put into place potentially. I mean that's how it read SBF: Well that's interesting because that's definitely not true I don't even know how to code, is the honest embarrassing answer. I certainly wasn't, like, building some backdoor into the system, I could barely use the system. He then goes on to describe how he used the UI, but didn't work with the underlying system and dips into a "long and almost boring story" about a little oopsie where they were wrong about the size of Alameda's balances. At this point Tiffany seems to have been distracted enough to press him on the back door (presumably the Alameda "fuck up" confession seemed more interesting). I dunno, I feel like if you're asked about using some sketchy-sounding functionality and using it to skim money, and you answer "Well I certainly didn't BUILD that!" then jingled your keys for a few minutes, it’s pretty clear you were involved somehow
      - SilverBirch 4y ago
        > The complaint alleges that Wang created FTX’s software code that allowed Alameda to divert FTX customer funds, https://www.sec.gov/news/press-release/2022-234 https://www.sec.gov/news/press-release/2022-234 That’s the press release from the SEC about their charges , saying Wang built a back door and Wang has pled guilty to those charges.
- dang 4y ago
  That's egregiously against the site guidelines and we ban accounts that do it. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
jrochkind1 4y ago
> he started to actually believe he can just make up reality. Yep, I believe he truly believes his own BS. Like probably the rest of the crypto scene. And, like, well, increasingly huge portions of the whole damn country and world these days? It's a make-your-own-self-serving-facts world. But yeah, I think he truly thinks he's some kind of a victim here, of some kind of a takedown of a solvent FTX that wasnt' doing anything different from most everyone else in the space (that might very well be true?!? it's a space built on BS and playing fast and loose). And probably truly feels bad for those who got screwed by it. He just doesn't see how it's anything he's responsible for. Isn't this the way all those people getting rich got rich, isn't this just how it's done? Isn't that "disruption"? He may not be wrong.
1vuio0pswjnm7 4y ago
IMHO, SBF is a shining symbol of a much larger problem that has been borne out of if not at least faciltated by the now crashing "tech" industry. What percentage of the top FTX creditors who curiously want to remain anonymous in the FTX bankruptcy are connected to this so-called "tech" industry. The media is suggesting there are some major "tech" industry proponents on the list. Internet-based surveillance and advertsing services disguised as "innovation", a "business model" and even as a utopia-like economic future for once healthier societies is a like a virus every bit as harmful as COVID. IMO.
1vuio0pswjnm7 4y ago
If SBF actually tries to go to trial and gets deposed in the lead up, then every one of these interviews, blog posts and tweets are just more documents his attorneys will give him to study in preparation. He will have to ensure every answer he gives is consistent with these prior statements. Does anyone think SBF can do this. If he plans to testify at trial, then he will have to go through this drill again. First SBF says "I fucked up." Now he is saying the implosion was due to factors outside his control. What is with his parents. Is he locked in his room playing video games. Do they have any idea what he is doing. I think he has a brother close to his age. How can these people stand by and let a family member make such idiotic choices. This is why the Silicon Valley people advising Zuckerberg have opted to keep him from having to testify in a federal trial on multiple occasions. Being truthful is not something these kids can do well and anyway the truth is far too dangerous for "tech" companies.
- 1vuio0pswjnm7 4y ago
  Obviously I am only referring to the civil cases. In additon to ones files by the SEC and CFTC, SBF has been named in numerous others as well. For example, papadakis-v-bankman-fried https://ia804701.us.archive.org/19/items/gov.uscourts.cand.406814/ https://ia804701.us.archive.org/19/items/gov.uscourts.cand.4... onusz-v-west-realm-shires-inc https://ia601405.us.archive.org/28/items/gov.uscourts.deb.188786/ https://ia601405.us.archive.org/28/items/gov.uscourts.deb.18... podalsky-v-bankman-fried (consolidated with garrison) https://ia801506.us.archive.org/17/items/gov.uscourts.flsd.624867/ https://ia801506.us.archive.org/17/items/gov.uscourts.flsd.6... jessup-v-bankman-fried https://ia801501.us.archive.org/10/items/gov.uscourts.cand.404758/ https://ia801501.us.archive.org/10/items/gov.uscourts.cand.4... hawkins-v-bankman-fried https://ia804706.us.archive.org/28/items/gov.uscourts.cand.404699/ https://ia804706.us.archive.org/28/items/gov.uscourts.cand.4... blockfi-inc-v-emergent-fidelity-technologies-ltd https://ia601405.us.archive.org/17/items/gov.uscourts.njb.1094107/ https://ia601405.us.archive.org/17/items/gov.uscourts.njb.10... pierce-v-bankman-fried https://ia904701.us.archive.org/20/items/gov.uscourts.cand.404275/ https://ia904701.us.archive.org/20/items/gov.uscourts.cand.4... kavuri-v-bankman-fried https://ia904708.us.archive.org/34/items/gov.uscourts.flsd.624069/ https://ia904708.us.archive.org/34/items/gov.uscourts.flsd.6... lam-v-bankman-fried https://ia801500.us.archive.org/2/items/gov.uscourts.cand.404079/ https://ia801500.us.archive.org/2/items/gov.uscourts.cand.40... garrison-v-bankman-fried https://ia601500.us.archive.org/8/items/gov.uscourts.flsd.623680/ https://ia601500.us.archive.org/8/items/gov.uscourts.flsd.62...

ulrashida 4y ago

Did you not see his two spreadsheets labelled "JUST AN ESTIMATE" that clearly show he is right? I would love to know the thought process behind his decision to make this post.

SilverBirch 4y ago
Presumably the thought process is something along the lines of "No one is going to look at this, only count the liquid stuff and make the very obvious point we were underwater even at the peak of the market".

breck 4y ago

[flagged]

SilverBirch 4y ago
God I wish someone would pay me for my HN comments.
smcl 4y ago
Which claims specifically need a citation?
- breck 4y ago
  ' when we literally have testimony'
  - smcl 4y ago
    Hmm so "testimony" is a bit firm, maybe it's referring to something I haven't seen yet but I read that as referring to the backdoor: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6DezodR9hNI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6DezodR9hNI If it is the backdoor, then to be honest his own statements on it make him look more guilty of it than anything else. Here's a transcript from that interview: Tiffany Fong: There was something about a backdoor that allowed you to execute commands that could alter the companies financial records without alerting others. That this was put in place, I think that was a Reuters article which made it seem like you secretly were moving money in the background. SBF: Wait and this is something that I would be doing? TF: It kind of said that SBF put like a secret backdoor so that secretly he was moving funds to Alameda and it was undetected and that this was something that you put into place potentially. I mean that's how it read SBF: Well that's interesting because that's definitely not true I don't even know how to code, is the honest embarrassing answer. I certainly wasn't, like, building some backdoor into the system, I could barely use the system. He then goes on to describe how he used the UI, but didn't work with the underlying system and dips into a "long and almost boring story" about a little oopsie where they were wrong about the size of Alameda's balances. At this point Tiffany seems to have been distracted enough to press him on the back door (presumably the Alameda "fuck up" confession seemed more interesting). I dunno, I feel like if you're asked about using some sketchy-sounding functionality and using it to skim money, and you answer "Well I certainly didn't BUILD that!" then jingled your keys for a few minutes, it’s pretty clear you were involved somehow
    - SilverBirch 4y ago
      > The complaint alleges that Wang created FTX’s software code that allowed Alameda to divert FTX customer funds, https://www.sec.gov/news/press-release/2022-234 https://www.sec.gov/news/press-release/2022-234 That’s the press release from the SEC about their charges , saying Wang built a back door and Wang has pled guilty to those charges.
dang 4y ago
That's egregiously against the site guidelines and we ban accounts that do it. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

jrochkind1 4y ago

> he started to actually believe he can just make up reality. Yep, I believe he truly believes his own BS. Like probably the rest of the crypto scene. And, like, well, increasingly huge portions of the whole damn country and world these days? It's a make-your-own-self-serving-facts world. But yeah, I think he truly thinks he's some kind of a victim here, of some kind of a takedown of a solvent FTX that wasnt' doing anything different from most everyone else in the space (that might very well be true?!? it's a space built on BS and playing fast and loose). And probably truly feels bad for those who got screwed by it. He just doesn't see how it's anything he's responsible for. Isn't this the way all those people getting rich got rich, isn't this just how it's done? Isn't that "disruption"? He may not be wrong.

1vuio0pswjnm7 4y ago

IMHO, SBF is a shining symbol of a much larger problem that has been borne out of if not at least faciltated by the now crashing "tech" industry. What percentage of the top FTX creditors who curiously want to remain anonymous in the FTX bankruptcy are connected to this so-called "tech" industry. The media is suggesting there are some major "tech" industry proponents on the list. Internet-based surveillance and advertsing services disguised as "innovation", a "business model" and even as a utopia-like economic future for once healthier societies is a like a virus every bit as harmful as COVID. IMO.

1vuio0pswjnm7 4y ago

If SBF actually tries to go to trial and gets deposed in the lead up, then every one of these interviews, blog posts and tweets are just more documents his attorneys will give him to study in preparation. He will have to ensure every answer he gives is consistent with these prior statements. Does anyone think SBF can do this. If he plans to testify at trial, then he will have to go through this drill again. First SBF says "I fucked up." Now he is saying the implosion was due to factors outside his control. What is with his parents. Is he locked in his room playing video games. Do they have any idea what he is doing. I think he has a brother close to his age. How can these people stand by and let a family member make such idiotic choices. This is why the Silicon Valley people advising Zuckerberg have opted to keep him from having to testify in a federal trial on multiple occasions. Being truthful is not something these kids can do well and anyway the truth is far too dangerous for "tech" companies.

1vuio0pswjnm7 4y ago
Obviously I am only referring to the civil cases. In additon to ones files by the SEC and CFTC, SBF has been named in numerous others as well. For example, papadakis-v-bankman-fried https://ia804701.us.archive.org/19/items/gov.uscourts.cand.406814/ https://ia804701.us.archive.org/19/items/gov.uscourts.cand.4... onusz-v-west-realm-shires-inc https://ia601405.us.archive.org/28/items/gov.uscourts.deb.188786/ https://ia601405.us.archive.org/28/items/gov.uscourts.deb.18... podalsky-v-bankman-fried (consolidated with garrison) https://ia801506.us.archive.org/17/items/gov.uscourts.flsd.624867/ https://ia801506.us.archive.org/17/items/gov.uscourts.flsd.6... jessup-v-bankman-fried https://ia801501.us.archive.org/10/items/gov.uscourts.cand.404758/ https://ia801501.us.archive.org/10/items/gov.uscourts.cand.4... hawkins-v-bankman-fried https://ia804706.us.archive.org/28/items/gov.uscourts.cand.404699/ https://ia804706.us.archive.org/28/items/gov.uscourts.cand.4... blockfi-inc-v-emergent-fidelity-technologies-ltd https://ia601405.us.archive.org/17/items/gov.uscourts.njb.1094107/ https://ia601405.us.archive.org/17/items/gov.uscourts.njb.10... pierce-v-bankman-fried https://ia904701.us.archive.org/20/items/gov.uscourts.cand.404275/ https://ia904701.us.archive.org/20/items/gov.uscourts.cand.4... kavuri-v-bankman-fried https://ia904708.us.archive.org/34/items/gov.uscourts.flsd.624069/ https://ia904708.us.archive.org/34/items/gov.uscourts.flsd.6... lam-v-bankman-fried https://ia801500.us.archive.org/2/items/gov.uscourts.cand.404079/ https://ia801500.us.archive.org/2/items/gov.uscourts.cand.40... garrison-v-bankman-fried https://ia601500.us.archive.org/8/items/gov.uscourts.flsd.623680/ https://ia601500.us.archive.org/8/items/gov.uscourts.flsd.62...