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But using Terraform with $CLOUD implies that you are familiar with $CLOUD - then if you know $CLOUD and bash why would you need to use Terraform to work with th

But using Terraform with $CLOUD implies that you are familiar with $CLOUD - then if you know $CLOUD and bash why would you need to use Terraform to work with that cloud? Also, as stated in a sibling comment, all the commands, expressions and capabilities of Terraform differ based on your $CLOUD, so in the end it's not that universal. In fact, it's not different from bash - bash is always the same, you just type `az` instead of `aws-cli`.

dagw 4y ago
Not everybody deploying to $CLOUD necessarily knows a lot of $CLOUD and bash. They might know that they need an MPI cluster with N Cores and X GB of RAM pr core, 10 Gbit interconnects and 200 GB of shared storage. Learning how to edit a Terraform template that someone else wrote to achieve this probably is a lot easier than learning how to edit an ad hoc bash script and probably a lot less error prone.
warrenm 4y ago
And when you don't have bash? ... >In fact, it's not different from bash - bash is always the same, you just type `az` instead of `aws-cli`. Terraform works on many platforms (https://developer.hashicorp.com/terraform/downloads https://developer.hashicorp.com/terraform/downloads) Not all have (or default to) bash Whereas Terraform is "the same" everywhere
ro_jazz 4y ago
Not arguing, just contributing with my personal non-expert experience. I am using Terraform because using AWS directly was too cumbersome, and I'm happy with it.
dragonwriter 4y ago
> then if you know $CLOUD and bash why would you need to use Terraform to work with that cloud? The utility of Infrastructure as Code (IAC) is not “you don’t have to understand the target cloud platform”, which is why cloud providers often have their own IAC solutions (e.g., AWS CloudFormation, and the additional abstractions–Serverless Application Model, Cloud Development Kit–built on top of CloudFormation); Terraform adds multiple cloud support on top, which is useful for people with workloads in different clouds or when working with a vendor whose in-house solution is inferior, but that’s not the whole point. The utility of IAC is that you don’t have to write custom code based on the current and desired state for each state transition change. You write a description of the target state, and the engine handles determining the current state, what transition code is needed, and executing the transition code.

dagw 4y ago

Not everybody deploying to $CLOUD necessarily knows a lot of $CLOUD and bash. They might know that they need an MPI cluster with N Cores and X GB of RAM pr core, 10 Gbit interconnects and 200 GB of shared storage. Learning how to edit a Terraform template that someone else wrote to achieve this probably is a lot easier than learning how to edit an ad hoc bash script and probably a lot less error prone.

warrenm 4y ago

And when you don't have bash? ... >In fact, it's not different from bash - bash is always the same, you just type `az` instead of `aws-cli`. Terraform works on many platforms (https://developer.hashicorp.com/terraform/downloads https://developer.hashicorp.com/terraform/downloads) Not all have (or default to) bash Whereas Terraform is "the same" everywhere

ro_jazz 4y ago

Not arguing, just contributing with my personal non-expert experience. I am using Terraform because using AWS directly was too cumbersome, and I'm happy with it.

dragonwriter 4y ago

> then if you know $CLOUD and bash why would you need to use Terraform to work with that cloud? The utility of Infrastructure as Code (IAC) is not “you don’t have to understand the target cloud platform”, which is why cloud providers often have their own IAC solutions (e.g., AWS CloudFormation, and the additional abstractions–Serverless Application Model, Cloud Development Kit–built on top of CloudFormation); Terraform adds multiple cloud support on top, which is useful for people with workloads in different clouds or when working with a vendor whose in-house solution is inferior, but that’s not the whole point. The utility of IAC is that you don’t have to write custom code based on the current and desired state for each state transition change. You write a description of the target state, and the engine handles determining the current state, what transition code is needed, and executing the transition code.