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I'm in for MathML, but could it be just a loadable JavaScript component instead? Considering the usage frequency of MathML, a built-in browser implementation lo

I'm in for MathML, but could it be just a loadable JavaScript component instead? Considering the usage frequency of MathML, a built-in browser implementation looks kind of wasteful.

dginev 4y ago
Let's revisit your comment in a couple of years, when people actually have had the incentive to publish enough <math> elements out there. If no one uses it, it will eventually get phased out. I have just about a billion <math> elements in the arXiv preview site I develop: https://ar5iv.labs.arxiv.org/ https://ar5iv.labs.arxiv.org/ And that is just one site. PubMed will likely have more than that at some point: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/
rhdunn 4y ago
MathJax is that, but it has issues with being an additional downloadable script, not fully integrating with accessibility, css, copying, etc. There are also some things like stretchable brackets that are hard to implement outside the browser.
miohtama 4y ago
This crossed my mind a well. However if you read here https://mathml.igalia.com/ https://mathml.igalia.com/ There are obvious benefits to have it in the core - Native implementation for efficient layout and automatic reflow. - No external resources required except for purely stylistic information. - Cross-compatible and high-quality rendering possible using TeX and OpenType MATH rules. - Visual rendering fully controlled by font and CSS styling. - Compatible with the other HTML5 technologies for best user and developer experience. - Formula content works well with browser UI: zooming, select, copy & paste, find text, etc. - Information properly exposed to assistive technologies Is it wasteful? Maybe. Is it better? Sure. Also there is the question because MathML is a niche other browsers need to have fallbacks / polyfills.
- mindcrime 4y ago
  - Formula content works well with browser UI: zooming, select, copy & paste, find text, etc. This alone, to me, is good enough reason to be excited for the return of native MathML rendering to Chrome. Now let's just hope this work gets propagated to Edge as well. Firefox, Chrome and Safari will now all have at least decent MathML support and since Edge is based on the same underlying engine as Chrome, there doesn't seem to be any obvious reason why MS wouldn't enable such support as well. fingers crossed
  - ec109685 4y ago
    I don't think Copy and Paste work correctly. You can select the equation but the copying and pasting turns into gibberish. ax^2 + bx + c turns into: � ⁢ � 2 + � ⁢ � + � HTML has those bad unicode characters too.

I'm in for MathML, but could it be just a loadable JavaScript component instead? Considering the usage frequency of MathML, a built-in browser implementation looks kind of wasteful.

dginev 4y ago

Let's revisit your comment in a couple of years, when people actually have had the incentive to publish enough <math> elements out there. If no one uses it, it will eventually get phased out. I have just about a billion <math> elements in the arXiv preview site I develop: https://ar5iv.labs.arxiv.org/ https://ar5iv.labs.arxiv.org/ And that is just one site. PubMed will likely have more than that at some point: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/

rhdunn 4y ago

MathJax is that, but it has issues with being an additional downloadable script, not fully integrating with accessibility, css, copying, etc. There are also some things like stretchable brackets that are hard to implement outside the browser.

miohtama 4y ago

This crossed my mind a well. However if you read here https://mathml.igalia.com/ https://mathml.igalia.com/ There are obvious benefits to have it in the core - Native implementation for efficient layout and automatic reflow. - No external resources required except for purely stylistic information. - Cross-compatible and high-quality rendering possible using TeX and OpenType MATH rules. - Visual rendering fully controlled by font and CSS styling. - Compatible with the other HTML5 technologies for best user and developer experience. - Formula content works well with browser UI: zooming, select, copy & paste, find text, etc. - Information properly exposed to assistive technologies Is it wasteful? Maybe. Is it better? Sure. Also there is the question because MathML is a niche other browsers need to have fallbacks / polyfills.

mindcrime 4y ago
- Formula content works well with browser UI: zooming, select, copy & paste, find text, etc. This alone, to me, is good enough reason to be excited for the return of native MathML rendering to Chrome. Now let's just hope this work gets propagated to Edge as well. Firefox, Chrome and Safari will now all have at least decent MathML support and since Edge is based on the same underlying engine as Chrome, there doesn't seem to be any obvious reason why MS wouldn't enable such support as well. fingers crossed
- ec109685 4y ago
  I don't think Copy and Paste work correctly. You can select the equation but the copying and pasting turns into gibberish. ax^2 + bx + c turns into: � ⁢ � 2 + � ⁢ � + � HTML has those bad unicode characters too.