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I got lucky here. My wife was emotionally broken when I met her (her mom died from cancer in HS, and then her family started scapegoating her father), so I coul

I got lucky here. My wife was emotionally broken when I met her (her mom died from cancer in HS, and then her family started scapegoating her father), so I could care for her without much reciprocation. And over the last ten years, as she's healed, I've learned to address my issues one by one to the point where I'm now on neutral ground emotionally. I can share and enjoy what I have with her, but we both lack the skills to go beyond the two of us. > Deep inside I just see other humans as potential attack vectors. This is the problem. All human interaction is built on trust, empathy, and authenticity. Without being able to make progress there, no lasting connection can be achieved. Because trust is so fundamental to being human, I see the entire effort to establish zero-trust anything as a fundamentally misguided and doomed-to-failure activity. If you want to change your point of view you'd need to overcome trust issues and the easiest way of doing that is by identifying and coming to terms with the source of your trust issues. Brute forcing it as I did (with my wife) was the emotional version of repeatedly getting full-body road rash over and over again (for both of us).

lordfrito 4y ago
Glad to hear. Sometimes a little luck is all it takes. I've read luck is just opportunity + preparedness. I don't have real control of opportunities, but I have agency to work on being prepared to identify and take advantage of them when they come along. At this phase in life, I've solved all my material problems, so I have plenty of free time, means, and energy that I can dedicate to solving this last big problem. Right now I'm dealing with the colossal amount of narcissistic selfishness that the average single adult in this country possesses. Attractive single woman at my age appear highly correlated with systemic selfish behavior and using people as a means to an end. Making it even harder is the material success I've found personally, it's like a magnet for every gold digger out there. Hard to develop trust in an environment full of people you shouldn't trust. I am regularly approached by women online looking for a sugar relationship. When did using people become this normalized? At least I've solved that one, I know it's not me any longer! That said, any advice on finding decent people to even try with?
- solarmist 4y ago
  > At this phase in life, I've solved all my material problems... That sounds like a signaling problem. If one of the first things you talk about is being wealthy or displaying a lack of concern about spending money, then people who key off will take an interest. To me, this is all very common sense that I'm sure you've heard before, but I'll share it in case my reasoning helps it resonate better. I would suggest connecting with people without the direct intention of dating. For example, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4gWMTDaxKk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4gWMTDaxKk Then as you meet people doing these other things, you can ask them out for a date or be friends. As you make friends, you'll have access to more datable people via your social network, which (mostly) removes the problem you're describing since the people are pre-vetted by the type of people you make friends with. (I.e., the traditional way of finding dates via your social network). The other option is to not talk about money/means/etc. (and avoid spending money during dates above the bare minimum; i.e., splitting the check) until after four or so dates, effectively weeding out those people quickly. Another thing is to avoid making assumptions about what other people want or who is/isn't datable. People will often artificially limit their options or agency, such as an unwavering belief that "the man should pay," etc.
  - lordfrito 4y ago
    Appreciate the advice, thanks.
    - solarmist 4y ago
      Any feedback on what resonates or not would be welcome.
      - lordfrito 4y ago
        Since you asked, I appreciated all of it, and all of it resonates. I know most of it. Some of it I actively do, some I've done and need a reminder, some of it is about getting my expectations back in line again. Yeah totally right about signaling. I'm a heart on my sleeve guy. I need to be reminded that I have to play a game at first, you can't just be yourself. I treat people well first (until they give me a reason not to), but even that is signaling and not working in my favor. Open/generous people just attract users. I actually already hold back a lot (being strangely open here for a change) but clearly it's still not near enough. Gotta keep reminding myself of that. About not dating: I've just spent 2+ years trying to connect with people without the intention of dating. I've found that most of the people I run into just aren't like me, probably because I'm digging in the wrong places. I live on a lake love to boat in the summer, but the crowd that attracts is just not the same as me. I realized most of them aren't my friends, they're just into having a friend with a boat and free booze. So I'm getting used in a way. So that's a me problem, and a signaling problem in a way. You're spot on about weeding people out fast, probably the #1 thing I've learned these last 2 years, I've cut a lot of these people out. Which stinks because they're fun, and I need people to boat with. So I'm back to trying dating in 2023 and see if I'm any wiser this time. 10 days in and already it's mostly just matches with scammers/escorts and sugar gals. I get the thing about meeting people just to do things, build a network, etc. Like I said I just must be digging in the wrong places. The social things I do like concerts and boats attract the wrong crowd, the bar crowd; and the intelligent/introvert side of me, well its hard to meet introverts. I'm going to make another effort on Meetup, focusing on groups that cater to introverts like books and board games. That's one thing I haven't tried (been focusing on extroverts as I figured that would be easier). Guess it means I have to boat less this summer, which stinks cause it's one of the things that brings me joy. Choices. Not talking about money etc, I really don't. But I'm just generous with myself and my time and it doesn't take long before people sniff out there's something different about me, some air of confidence, assumed success. I just don't have the same problems they have and it shows in my demeanor, the way I talk, wisdom compassion whatever. It attracts people that need things. Again, you're right, it's a signaling problem. I guess I just have to play coy or something. I don't know a lot of successful people in my personal life (other than colleagues, but I don't mix business and personal). I come from lower mid class so those are my peeps and I understand them, but at the same time I'm not like them any more. I also don't come from upper middle class, so I don't really fit in there no common upbringing. Lastly, your point about don't make assumptions. You're absolutely right, and I need to be reminded of this. Take more risks (no risk no reward) instead of assuming. I get it, need to put it into more practice. I need to shake things up. I'm still upbeat enough to get up and try again. I just feel like every time I put myself out there and try and open up, I learn new lessons on why not to trust people. Like I said, 2 years of trying something new, only to have to cut most of 'em out. Makes me wonder why I keep putting myself out there I guess. Which is why I asked for a new / outside perspective from you in all honesty. I need new things to try I'm running out of ideas. I'm convinced that some of this is societal. We live in brutal times, people dehumanized, struggling. Can't change that, but I can change what I'm doing. Thanks again for taking your time with an honest and helpful response. Mixed feelings about sharing this in a public forum, but HN rules, a lot of great intelligent helpful people here.

lordfrito 4y ago

Glad to hear. Sometimes a little luck is all it takes. I've read luck is just opportunity + preparedness. I don't have real control of opportunities, but I have agency to work on being prepared to identify and take advantage of them when they come along. At this phase in life, I've solved all my material problems, so I have plenty of free time, means, and energy that I can dedicate to solving this last big problem. Right now I'm dealing with the colossal amount of narcissistic selfishness that the average single adult in this country possesses. Attractive single woman at my age appear highly correlated with systemic selfish behavior and using people as a means to an end. Making it even harder is the material success I've found personally, it's like a magnet for every gold digger out there. Hard to develop trust in an environment full of people you shouldn't trust. I am regularly approached by women online looking for a sugar relationship. When did using people become this normalized? At least I've solved that one, I know it's not me any longer! That said, any advice on finding decent people to even try with?

solarmist 4y ago
> At this phase in life, I've solved all my material problems... That sounds like a signaling problem. If one of the first things you talk about is being wealthy or displaying a lack of concern about spending money, then people who key off will take an interest. To me, this is all very common sense that I'm sure you've heard before, but I'll share it in case my reasoning helps it resonate better. I would suggest connecting with people without the direct intention of dating. For example, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4gWMTDaxKk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4gWMTDaxKk Then as you meet people doing these other things, you can ask them out for a date or be friends. As you make friends, you'll have access to more datable people via your social network, which (mostly) removes the problem you're describing since the people are pre-vetted by the type of people you make friends with. (I.e., the traditional way of finding dates via your social network). The other option is to not talk about money/means/etc. (and avoid spending money during dates above the bare minimum; i.e., splitting the check) until after four or so dates, effectively weeding out those people quickly. Another thing is to avoid making assumptions about what other people want or who is/isn't datable. People will often artificially limit their options or agency, such as an unwavering belief that "the man should pay," etc.
- lordfrito 4y ago
  Appreciate the advice, thanks.
  - solarmist 4y ago
    Any feedback on what resonates or not would be welcome.
    - lordfrito 4y ago
      Since you asked, I appreciated all of it, and all of it resonates. I know most of it. Some of it I actively do, some I've done and need a reminder, some of it is about getting my expectations back in line again. Yeah totally right about signaling. I'm a heart on my sleeve guy. I need to be reminded that I have to play a game at first, you can't just be yourself. I treat people well first (until they give me a reason not to), but even that is signaling and not working in my favor. Open/generous people just attract users. I actually already hold back a lot (being strangely open here for a change) but clearly it's still not near enough. Gotta keep reminding myself of that. About not dating: I've just spent 2+ years trying to connect with people without the intention of dating. I've found that most of the people I run into just aren't like me, probably because I'm digging in the wrong places. I live on a lake love to boat in the summer, but the crowd that attracts is just not the same as me. I realized most of them aren't my friends, they're just into having a friend with a boat and free booze. So I'm getting used in a way. So that's a me problem, and a signaling problem in a way. You're spot on about weeding people out fast, probably the #1 thing I've learned these last 2 years, I've cut a lot of these people out. Which stinks because they're fun, and I need people to boat with. So I'm back to trying dating in 2023 and see if I'm any wiser this time. 10 days in and already it's mostly just matches with scammers/escorts and sugar gals. I get the thing about meeting people just to do things, build a network, etc. Like I said I just must be digging in the wrong places. The social things I do like concerts and boats attract the wrong crowd, the bar crowd; and the intelligent/introvert side of me, well its hard to meet introverts. I'm going to make another effort on Meetup, focusing on groups that cater to introverts like books and board games. That's one thing I haven't tried (been focusing on extroverts as I figured that would be easier). Guess it means I have to boat less this summer, which stinks cause it's one of the things that brings me joy. Choices. Not talking about money etc, I really don't. But I'm just generous with myself and my time and it doesn't take long before people sniff out there's something different about me, some air of confidence, assumed success. I just don't have the same problems they have and it shows in my demeanor, the way I talk, wisdom compassion whatever. It attracts people that need things. Again, you're right, it's a signaling problem. I guess I just have to play coy or something. I don't know a lot of successful people in my personal life (other than colleagues, but I don't mix business and personal). I come from lower mid class so those are my peeps and I understand them, but at the same time I'm not like them any more. I also don't come from upper middle class, so I don't really fit in there no common upbringing. Lastly, your point about don't make assumptions. You're absolutely right, and I need to be reminded of this. Take more risks (no risk no reward) instead of assuming. I get it, need to put it into more practice. I need to shake things up. I'm still upbeat enough to get up and try again. I just feel like every time I put myself out there and try and open up, I learn new lessons on why not to trust people. Like I said, 2 years of trying something new, only to have to cut most of 'em out. Makes me wonder why I keep putting myself out there I guess. Which is why I asked for a new / outside perspective from you in all honesty. I need new things to try I'm running out of ideas. I'm convinced that some of this is societal. We live in brutal times, people dehumanized, struggling. Can't change that, but I can change what I'm doing. Thanks again for taking your time with an honest and helpful response. Mixed feelings about sharing this in a public forum, but HN rules, a lot of great intelligent helpful people here.