4 ms·

So you are Russia. You have a powerful misinformation team that can sway global opinion. Out of all objectives that further Russian power, you have decided on

So you are Russia. You have a powerful misinformation team that can sway global opinion. Out of all objectives that further Russian power, you have decided on the squashing new nuclear plants. Why this and not some other objective? Why can't they sway the global opinion on Ukraine? Surely they are trying.

NovemberWhiskey 4y ago
>Why this and not some other objective? Why can't they sway the global opinion on Ukraine? Surely they are trying. The Overton window is a thing, right? "Nuclear power might be really unsafe" is a much easier sell in the public discourse than "it's OK to invade your peaceful neighbors".
- megaman821 4y ago
  That is exactly what I mean. There is virtually no public support for invading your peaceful neighbor, and no amount of misinformation is going to fundamentally change that. Support for building nuclear power plants is a contentious issue. Of course Russia wants to nudge the outcome in their favor, but saying Russian misinformation is mostly responsible for the anti-nuclear sentiment is crazy.
  - mannerheim 4y ago
    > There is virtually no public support for invading your peaceful neighbor, and no amount of misinformation is going to fundamentally change that. I mean, there is a sizeable minority who have been convinced by Russian propaganda on this; typically they refer to Euromaidan as a coup, blame the invasion on Ukraine for not implementing Minsk, claim Ukraine is banning the Russian language, and so forth. If propaganda can bump this from zero to twenty percent, why not from 40 to 60?
    - mrguyorama 4y ago
      These points are literally made on fox news many nights. How much does it cost to get fox news to broadcast your propaganda to 60 million americans versus bribing enough american politicians that have enough sway to actually disrupt things. Russia buying a politician would hopefully be a huge story. Russia buying advertising in the US to push for dis-unity or their abhorrent propaganda about Ukraine being full of nazis or that 1 billion dollars is a lot to pay (in old, out of date, expensive to decommission hardware) to absolutely defang the largest rival we had last century is derogatorily labeled as "Russiagate" and "conspiracy theory" and "liberal brainworms".
saint_fiasco 4y ago
I think the idea is that if they can delay the construction of new nuclear plants they increase Europe's dependence on Russian oil.
- asdff 4y ago
  You would think it would be a lot more straightforward and effective to just directly bribe policymakers than to crank out propaganda and hope 1% of it sticks.
  - mannerheim 4y ago
    What do you think Schröder is?
sigstoat 4y ago
> Out of all objectives that further Russian power, you have decided on the squashing new nuclear plants. it's not like it's a team of five guys slogging away in the propaganda mines with pick axes. they can pursue a number of goals simultaneously, limited mostly by budget and probably other geopolitical concerns, rather than video game-esque restrictions on the total number of things they can propagandize about simultaneously. > Why this and not some other objective? Why can't they sway the global opinion on Ukraine? Surely they are trying. they've had a lot longer to work on nuclear than the current invasion. they've also had plenty of success in the past with ukraine-related misinformation, see walter duranty.
bioemerl 4y ago
> Why this and not some other objective? You do both. Europeans are much more easily convinced that nuclear energy is scary.
93po 4y ago
Russian's main export is oil/gas/coal/etc. It's roughly half of all their exports and over a $100 billion worth every year. Yes, squashing new nuclear plants profits them tremendously, and protecting their oil/gas/etc export business is likely one of their top priorities.

NovemberWhiskey 4y ago

>Why this and not some other objective? Why can't they sway the global opinion on Ukraine? Surely they are trying. The Overton window is a thing, right? "Nuclear power might be really unsafe" is a much easier sell in the public discourse than "it's OK to invade your peaceful neighbors".

megaman821 4y ago
That is exactly what I mean. There is virtually no public support for invading your peaceful neighbor, and no amount of misinformation is going to fundamentally change that. Support for building nuclear power plants is a contentious issue. Of course Russia wants to nudge the outcome in their favor, but saying Russian misinformation is mostly responsible for the anti-nuclear sentiment is crazy.
- mannerheim 4y ago
  > There is virtually no public support for invading your peaceful neighbor, and no amount of misinformation is going to fundamentally change that. I mean, there is a sizeable minority who have been convinced by Russian propaganda on this; typically they refer to Euromaidan as a coup, blame the invasion on Ukraine for not implementing Minsk, claim Ukraine is banning the Russian language, and so forth. If propaganda can bump this from zero to twenty percent, why not from 40 to 60?
  - mrguyorama 4y ago
    These points are literally made on fox news many nights. How much does it cost to get fox news to broadcast your propaganda to 60 million americans versus bribing enough american politicians that have enough sway to actually disrupt things. Russia buying a politician would hopefully be a huge story. Russia buying advertising in the US to push for dis-unity or their abhorrent propaganda about Ukraine being full of nazis or that 1 billion dollars is a lot to pay (in old, out of date, expensive to decommission hardware) to absolutely defang the largest rival we had last century is derogatorily labeled as "Russiagate" and "conspiracy theory" and "liberal brainworms".

saint_fiasco 4y ago

I think the idea is that if they can delay the construction of new nuclear plants they increase Europe's dependence on Russian oil.

asdff 4y ago
You would think it would be a lot more straightforward and effective to just directly bribe policymakers than to crank out propaganda and hope 1% of it sticks.
- mannerheim 4y ago
  What do you think Schröder is?

sigstoat 4y ago

> Out of all objectives that further Russian power, you have decided on the squashing new nuclear plants. it's not like it's a team of five guys slogging away in the propaganda mines with pick axes. they can pursue a number of goals simultaneously, limited mostly by budget and probably other geopolitical concerns, rather than video game-esque restrictions on the total number of things they can propagandize about simultaneously. > Why this and not some other objective? Why can't they sway the global opinion on Ukraine? Surely they are trying. they've had a lot longer to work on nuclear than the current invasion. they've also had plenty of success in the past with ukraine-related misinformation, see walter duranty.

bioemerl 4y ago

> Why this and not some other objective? You do both. Europeans are much more easily convinced that nuclear energy is scary.

93po 4y ago

Russian's main export is oil/gas/coal/etc. It's roughly half of all their exports and over a $100 billion worth every year. Yes, squashing new nuclear plants profits them tremendously, and protecting their oil/gas/etc export business is likely one of their top priorities.