6 ms·

Surely you can see how induction would become much, much cheaper with mass production and adoption after this ban comes into place. Cheap to retrofit, no emiss

Surely you can see how induction would become much, much cheaper with mass production and adoption after this ban comes into place. Cheap to retrofit, no emissions, no fossil fuel use. Induction is pretty much better in all conceivable ways.

endisneigh 4y ago
Sure it'll become cheaper, but it still would be more expensive than a gas range. A gas stove is very simple. Furthermore the use of gas heating per the study are in the coldest places - the same places that are using fossil fuels to heat anyway, even with new construction. This is not to say that we shouldn't move towards induction and heat pumps, but doing this under the guise of safety is disingenuous. The real issue is improper cooking procedure. If the government wants to encourage emission free heating and cooking they should simply offer rebates, which some counties are beginning to do.
- giardini 4y ago
  And the gas stove still works during hurricanes.
  - vanilla_nut 4y ago
    Couldn't induction as well, if you have solar panels and maybe a battery in your house?
    - oaktrout 4y ago
      Assuming you can afford solar panels and a battery and they are not damaged in the storm and you don't go too long without sunny weather and ...
      - factsarelolz 4y ago
        Yeah but couldn't you just... run a biodiesel generator to recharge your batteries?
      - smileysteve 4y ago
        Most of that applies to a gas generator, even moreso. The generator you use once every year, but the gas regularly goes stale; are you really going to want to go refill it and hand crank it in a hurricane when the auto start didn't kick on? And you're hoping it, its ventilation, its fuel supply, and it's wiring aren't damaged or flooded.
        oaktrout 4y ago
        One advantage that gas stoves have is that they don't need electricity to cook, so if your batteries or generators fail, you can still prepare a meal while you wait for the power to be restored.
    - sponaugle 4y ago
      You would need a lot of batteries. My induction top draws about 3kw when going strong.
      - DeRock 4y ago
        My car has 77kWh of batteries, so it could power that stove for 24 hours straight.
    - jacquesm 4y ago
      Most grid-tie inverters need the grid to function.
  - dzhiurgis 4y ago
    So does $10 camping gas stove
stefan_ 4y ago
Induction has already taken over the low budget range. There is no reason to have a gas stove anymore other than inertia and ignorance to the health risks.
- peteradio 4y ago
  > no reason to have a gas stove anymore other than inertia and ignorance to the health risks. Or preference for a superior cooking experience.
  - LargoLasskhyfv 4y ago
    I'd call that BS because imaginary...
    - peteradio 4y ago
      My lived experience is imaginary, does that make me imaginary? But I think therefore I am, so I'm not imaginary, yet my lived experience is imaginary. Is this like imaginary numbers where it is really just a poor descriptor for whatever it is you are asserting?
      - LargoLasskhyfv 4y ago
        Naa. I know cooking with gas from a long time ago. Also with normal electric stoves. I just think there is nothing better than induction fields ATM. Maybe you had bad ones? It's fast, it enables precise and dynamic control, it doesn't stink, it's easy to clean, and whatnot else. Cooking with gas is an obsolete thing, like computing with punchcards. Maybe your electrical installation is insufficient, or you tried suboptimal(for induction) pans, pots and kettles? Dunno. Edit: I'm aware of phrases like https://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/now+we%27re+cooking+with+gas https://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/now+we%27re+cooking+wit... btw. Still makes no sense anymore, except for camping, maybe.
        kelipso 4y ago
driverdan 4y ago
That's the opposite of what would happen. Competition pushes down prices. If gas is eliminated it reduces competition, pushing up demand and prices for induction.
- multiplegeorges 4y ago
  It would increase the supply and variety of available induction models, since there would be so much new market to capture, thus driving down price of induction ranges.
  - Tagbert 4y ago
    During the transition period when homes need to switch over, the prices of induction stoves would go up with the increased demand. It would only be after all of the gas stoves have been replaced that induction stoves would need to reduce prices to prevent a sales volume collapse.
sbradford26 4y ago
I personally am switching from a propane range to a induction cooktop as we speak, but saying induction is cheap to retro fit is definitely a stretch. My scenario is an unfinished basement below the kitchen and a really short electrical run. Materials: Induction Cooktop $900 (We are switching from a range to a cooktop, the cheapest induction range I know of is around $1100) 25ft 8/3 Romex wire: $153 So over 1k just in materials. I plan on wiring everything myself but if someone is not able to do that probably add another $500 for an electrician to do it. Finally that cost can balloon quickly depending on how accessible the install is and the distance.
- multiplegeorges 4y ago
  My quick comment left off some of the context that was in my head. The retrofit part of this was referring to the ban on gas stoves being about fumes/pollutants in the household air. If you didn't have an externally venting vent hood, then retrofiting a vent hood would be more expensive that installing an induction top, I'd wager.
  - sbradford26 4y ago
    It definitely depends on the situation. Most likely if we had kept our current range getting a properly range hood would have been the cost of a new hood and 6 feet of insulated duct. If I went with a cheap hood that would be under $100. But if the floor joists ran a different direction in our house it could easily balloon to hundreds of dollars for an install.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- fragmede 4y ago
  What the cost, including insurance, both for the work and afterwards, for a gas run? $2k for some home work is nothing.
2devnull 4y ago
Will never use one unless I’m forced and I know others who feel the same. Induction are for people who don’t cook. So what’s the point. You can not cook on the older stoves and save energy used in swapping out for a new appliance. Think if the energy cost in replacing a large fraction of American cooktops, for no good reason.
- thrill 4y ago
  "Induction are for people who don’t cook." Well, that's a bullshit claim.
  - 2devnull 4y ago
    It’s so well known that it’s absurd to even try to argue the point: https://www.thedailymeal.com/cook/5-reasons-top-chefs-prefer-gas-cooktops https://www.thedailymeal.com/cook/5-reasons-top-chefs-prefer... Watch a cooking show sometime. Better yet, ask an actual chef.
    - kshahkshah 4y ago
      Neither you nor the person you responded to need to take the tone y'all are. Anyway, that article you linked references electric, not induction just FYI
    - LargoLasskhyfv 4y ago
      That is from 2014, so probably before or just at the beginning of the induction craze. It only mentions 'electric', so probably normal electric or something like https://www.schott-ceran.com/en/benefits https://www.schott-ceran.com/en/benefits That is a comparison of apples to oranges, and does not apply to induction vs. gas. With that it is the opposite. Yes, induction is even faster than gas, and more precise, while way more convenient because the only thing getting hot is the pot or pan. You even can put a sheet of paper below the pot, it will be brown, but only from the residual heat radiating out of the pot. It won't burn! Btw. the chefs in cooking shows around here do induction :-)
  - exclusiv 4y ago

endisneigh 4y ago

Sure it'll become cheaper, but it still would be more expensive than a gas range. A gas stove is very simple. Furthermore the use of gas heating per the study are in the coldest places - the same places that are using fossil fuels to heat anyway, even with new construction. This is not to say that we shouldn't move towards induction and heat pumps, but doing this under the guise of safety is disingenuous. The real issue is improper cooking procedure. If the government wants to encourage emission free heating and cooking they should simply offer rebates, which some counties are beginning to do.

giardini 4y ago
And the gas stove still works during hurricanes.
- vanilla_nut 4y ago
  Couldn't induction as well, if you have solar panels and maybe a battery in your house?
  - oaktrout 4y ago
    Assuming you can afford solar panels and a battery and they are not damaged in the storm and you don't go too long without sunny weather and ...
    - factsarelolz 4y ago
      Yeah but couldn't you just... run a biodiesel generator to recharge your batteries?
    - smileysteve 4y ago
      Most of that applies to a gas generator, even moreso. The generator you use once every year, but the gas regularly goes stale; are you really going to want to go refill it and hand crank it in a hurricane when the auto start didn't kick on? And you're hoping it, its ventilation, its fuel supply, and it's wiring aren't damaged or flooded.
      - oaktrout 4y ago
        One advantage that gas stoves have is that they don't need electricity to cook, so if your batteries or generators fail, you can still prepare a meal while you wait for the power to be restored.
  - sponaugle 4y ago
    You would need a lot of batteries. My induction top draws about 3kw when going strong.
    - DeRock 4y ago
      My car has 77kWh of batteries, so it could power that stove for 24 hours straight.
  - jacquesm 4y ago
    Most grid-tie inverters need the grid to function.
- dzhiurgis 4y ago
  So does $10 camping gas stove

stefan_ 4y ago

Induction has already taken over the low budget range. There is no reason to have a gas stove anymore other than inertia and ignorance to the health risks.

peteradio 4y ago
> no reason to have a gas stove anymore other than inertia and ignorance to the health risks. Or preference for a superior cooking experience.
- LargoLasskhyfv 4y ago
  I'd call that BS because imaginary...
  - peteradio 4y ago
    My lived experience is imaginary, does that make me imaginary? But I think therefore I am, so I'm not imaginary, yet my lived experience is imaginary. Is this like imaginary numbers where it is really just a poor descriptor for whatever it is you are asserting?
    - LargoLasskhyfv 4y ago
      Naa. I know cooking with gas from a long time ago. Also with normal electric stoves. I just think there is nothing better than induction fields ATM. Maybe you had bad ones? It's fast, it enables precise and dynamic control, it doesn't stink, it's easy to clean, and whatnot else. Cooking with gas is an obsolete thing, like computing with punchcards. Maybe your electrical installation is insufficient, or you tried suboptimal(for induction) pans, pots and kettles? Dunno. Edit: I'm aware of phrases like https://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/now+we%27re+cooking+with+gas https://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/now+we%27re+cooking+wit... btw. Still makes no sense anymore, except for camping, maybe.
      - kelipso 4y ago

driverdan 4y ago

That's the opposite of what would happen. Competition pushes down prices. If gas is eliminated it reduces competition, pushing up demand and prices for induction.

multiplegeorges 4y ago
It would increase the supply and variety of available induction models, since there would be so much new market to capture, thus driving down price of induction ranges.
- Tagbert 4y ago
  During the transition period when homes need to switch over, the prices of induction stoves would go up with the increased demand. It would only be after all of the gas stoves have been replaced that induction stoves would need to reduce prices to prevent a sales volume collapse.

sbradford26 4y ago

I personally am switching from a propane range to a induction cooktop as we speak, but saying induction is cheap to retro fit is definitely a stretch. My scenario is an unfinished basement below the kitchen and a really short electrical run. Materials: Induction Cooktop $900 (We are switching from a range to a cooktop, the cheapest induction range I know of is around $1100) 25ft 8/3 Romex wire: $153 So over 1k just in materials. I plan on wiring everything myself but if someone is not able to do that probably add another $500 for an electrician to do it. Finally that cost can balloon quickly depending on how accessible the install is and the distance.

multiplegeorges 4y ago
My quick comment left off some of the context that was in my head. The retrofit part of this was referring to the ban on gas stoves being about fumes/pollutants in the household air. If you didn't have an externally venting vent hood, then retrofiting a vent hood would be more expensive that installing an induction top, I'd wager.
- sbradford26 4y ago
  It definitely depends on the situation. Most likely if we had kept our current range getting a properly range hood would have been the cost of a new hood and 6 feet of insulated duct. If I went with a cheap hood that would be under $100. But if the floor joists ran a different direction in our house it could easily balloon to hundreds of dollars for an install.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
fragmede 4y ago
What the cost, including insurance, both for the work and afterwards, for a gas run? $2k for some home work is nothing.

2devnull 4y ago

Will never use one unless I’m forced and I know others who feel the same. Induction are for people who don’t cook. So what’s the point. You can not cook on the older stoves and save energy used in swapping out for a new appliance. Think if the energy cost in replacing a large fraction of American cooktops, for no good reason.

thrill 4y ago
"Induction are for people who don’t cook." Well, that's a bullshit claim.
- 2devnull 4y ago
  It’s so well known that it’s absurd to even try to argue the point: https://www.thedailymeal.com/cook/5-reasons-top-chefs-prefer-gas-cooktops https://www.thedailymeal.com/cook/5-reasons-top-chefs-prefer... Watch a cooking show sometime. Better yet, ask an actual chef.
  - kshahkshah 4y ago
    Neither you nor the person you responded to need to take the tone y'all are. Anyway, that article you linked references electric, not induction just FYI
  - LargoLasskhyfv 4y ago
    That is from 2014, so probably before or just at the beginning of the induction craze. It only mentions 'electric', so probably normal electric or something like https://www.schott-ceran.com/en/benefits https://www.schott-ceran.com/en/benefits That is a comparison of apples to oranges, and does not apply to induction vs. gas. With that it is the opposite. Yes, induction is even faster than gas, and more precise, while way more convenient because the only thing getting hot is the pot or pan. You even can put a sheet of paper below the pot, it will be brown, but only from the residual heat radiating out of the pot. It won't burn! Btw. the chefs in cooking shows around here do induction :-)
- exclusiv 4y ago