5 ms·

I am missing: "How could we make the world a better place while doing good business?" Probably too extreme a question.

by college_physics 4y ago

xoptions 4y ago
What do you think about utopia?
- college_physics 4y ago
  According to search behavior at least, interest in utopias is growing steadily since the fifties. The fans of the "you never had it so good" theory must work a bit harder https://www.google.com/search?channel=fs&client=ubuntu&q=utopia+etymology https://www.google.com/search?channel=fs&client=ubuntu&q=uto... Interestingly, while from the beginning the word utopia was used to refer to a desirable (perfect) society, etymologically it simply means a place that does not exist. In contrast to dystopia, which is clearly a bad place.
  - tremon 4y ago
    etymologically it simply means a place that does not exist This isn't true, I think? Assuming that it derives from the Greek τόπος (location), it literally means "good place" (εὖ-τόπος). The no-such-place translation in Greek would probably be ἄτοπος, but that's an existing word and uses one of the other meanings of τόπος (it means uncommon or absurd).
TeMPOraL 4y ago
Ok, so a slightly less extreme version: "What would you do if you discovered that your company's core product or service has a net negative influence on the world?". This is a hypothetical, so assume the evidence you have is clear and the conclusion correct.
safety1st 4y ago
It's not extreme, but it's somewhat naive. If you want to make the world a better place, there are usually better ways to do so than via a for-profit business. PR stunts aside, a business is where you allocate capital that needs to generate a return. Why overload this concept? Invest your money in a nonprofit or a charity instead. If you want to ride a horse, don't argue with a cow because it isn't a horse. Milk it, sell the milk, and buy a horse. ...And if this is not a discussion about how you personally are allocating your capital, your best next step is to go generate more capital because then you can invest it however you damn well please. :)
- college_physics 4y ago
  Au-contraire, I think its naive to think that when such a large fraction of our lives (and economic activity) is built around particular types of for-profit businesses that we can somehow achieve our broader goals without them. We must break that spell. For-profit business are not structured according to some immutable laws of nature. Everything about them is a legal construct and it can be tweaked. Corporate entities didn't even exist until a few centuries ago. There is probably an entire spectrum of entities one can have between a charity and a typical modern corporate.
  - safety1st 4y ago
    Who's this "we" you're referring to that will enact these changes? Is it the shareholders of the companies? That's a no go - they won't go much beyond making token sacrifices for the sake of PR. Is it the government? The regulators and the executives of the companies they regulate are frequently the same people - they do their time in private enterprise and then they become policymakers for the industry they were working in. The justification for this is that an industry needs to be regulated by people who understand that industry in depth (if you're a programmer - do things go well when all the rules around your work are made by non-programmers?). Is it the people? Depends on the country you're in frankly. In the US popular opinion doesn't really support heavy-handed corporate regulation. There are some high impact issues like anti-trust where the public is fairly sympathetic to reigning in the biggest bad guys and I think those are good places to put your resources. Again, the best use of those resources is putting them into an organization dedicated to working on that issue. And the more capital you acquire from your business, the more impact you'll have. My point of view isn't that we should have no corporate governance. But I have the hard-nosed realist view that the wishful thinking of "we" is ineffective. It has a poor track record. I'm saying a better approach is to go make money and then use it to alter the fabric of reality directly. Maybe network with other people who've made their money and convince them to do the same. This is easier than most people realize, I mean it takes a lot of work and time, but it's the type of work that will prepare you to vet organizations and make smart decisions about who can do the most with your contributions anyway.
smartbear 4y ago
I like that a lot. I'll probably add that to the piece, thank you!
- smartbear 4y ago
  I actually did add this as another prompt. Thanks again for the great idea.
humane_tech 4y ago
This is almost exactly the question that lead to the success of Humanitix. https://www.humanitix.com/au/about-us https://www.humanitix.com/au/about-us. https://www.afr.com/technology/tech-platform-reimagines-ethical-capitalism-20220313-p5a4b4 https://www.afr.com/technology/tech-platform-reimagines-ethi... There are a few other similar examples, like https://thankyou.co https://thankyou.co and https://au.whogivesacrap.org https://au.whogivesacrap.org.

I am missing: "How could we make the world a better place while doing good business?" Probably too extreme a question.

xoptions 4y ago

What do you think about utopia?

college_physics 4y ago
According to search behavior at least, interest in utopias is growing steadily since the fifties. The fans of the "you never had it so good" theory must work a bit harder https://www.google.com/search?channel=fs&client=ubuntu&q=utopia+etymology https://www.google.com/search?channel=fs&client=ubuntu&q=uto... Interestingly, while from the beginning the word utopia was used to refer to a desirable (perfect) society, etymologically it simply means a place that does not exist. In contrast to dystopia, which is clearly a bad place.
- tremon 4y ago
  etymologically it simply means a place that does not exist This isn't true, I think? Assuming that it derives from the Greek τόπος (location), it literally means "good place" (εὖ-τόπος). The no-such-place translation in Greek would probably be ἄτοπος, but that's an existing word and uses one of the other meanings of τόπος (it means uncommon or absurd).

TeMPOraL 4y ago

Ok, so a slightly less extreme version: "What would you do if you discovered that your company's core product or service has a net negative influence on the world?". This is a hypothetical, so assume the evidence you have is clear and the conclusion correct.

safety1st 4y ago

It's not extreme, but it's somewhat naive. If you want to make the world a better place, there are usually better ways to do so than via a for-profit business. PR stunts aside, a business is where you allocate capital that needs to generate a return. Why overload this concept? Invest your money in a nonprofit or a charity instead. If you want to ride a horse, don't argue with a cow because it isn't a horse. Milk it, sell the milk, and buy a horse. ...And if this is not a discussion about how you personally are allocating your capital, your best next step is to go generate more capital because then you can invest it however you damn well please. :)

college_physics 4y ago
Au-contraire, I think its naive to think that when such a large fraction of our lives (and economic activity) is built around particular types of for-profit businesses that we can somehow achieve our broader goals without them. We must break that spell. For-profit business are not structured according to some immutable laws of nature. Everything about them is a legal construct and it can be tweaked. Corporate entities didn't even exist until a few centuries ago. There is probably an entire spectrum of entities one can have between a charity and a typical modern corporate.
- safety1st 4y ago
  Who's this "we" you're referring to that will enact these changes? Is it the shareholders of the companies? That's a no go - they won't go much beyond making token sacrifices for the sake of PR. Is it the government? The regulators and the executives of the companies they regulate are frequently the same people - they do their time in private enterprise and then they become policymakers for the industry they were working in. The justification for this is that an industry needs to be regulated by people who understand that industry in depth (if you're a programmer - do things go well when all the rules around your work are made by non-programmers?). Is it the people? Depends on the country you're in frankly. In the US popular opinion doesn't really support heavy-handed corporate regulation. There are some high impact issues like anti-trust where the public is fairly sympathetic to reigning in the biggest bad guys and I think those are good places to put your resources. Again, the best use of those resources is putting them into an organization dedicated to working on that issue. And the more capital you acquire from your business, the more impact you'll have. My point of view isn't that we should have no corporate governance. But I have the hard-nosed realist view that the wishful thinking of "we" is ineffective. It has a poor track record. I'm saying a better approach is to go make money and then use it to alter the fabric of reality directly. Maybe network with other people who've made their money and convince them to do the same. This is easier than most people realize, I mean it takes a lot of work and time, but it's the type of work that will prepare you to vet organizations and make smart decisions about who can do the most with your contributions anyway.

smartbear 4y ago

I like that a lot. I'll probably add that to the piece, thank you!

smartbear 4y ago
I actually did add this as another prompt. Thanks again for the great idea.

humane_tech 4y ago

This is almost exactly the question that lead to the success of Humanitix. https://www.humanitix.com/au/about-us https://www.humanitix.com/au/about-us. https://www.afr.com/technology/tech-platform-reimagines-ethical-capitalism-20220313-p5a4b4 https://www.afr.com/technology/tech-platform-reimagines-ethi... There are a few other similar examples, like https://thankyou.co https://thankyou.co and https://au.whogivesacrap.org https://au.whogivesacrap.org.