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I live in Nijmegen where I cycle a lot. I also lived in Arnhem where I was situated near some very steep hills, for some years I almost didn't cycle there and w

I live in Nijmegen where I cycle a lot. I also lived in Arnhem where I was situated near some very steep hills, for some years I almost didn't cycle there and walked a lot. I guess walking is also good, but my point is: one needs enough flatness to make cycling attractive. Cycling in cities like Amsterdam is totally not attractive to me, just too busy with bikes. ;)

alamortsubite 4y ago
The obstacle to cycling posed by steep hills is being diminished greatly by e-bikes. Unfortunately, the problem with traffic in Amsterdam is not, but I think that only serves to reinforce how attractive bikes are for commuting. It reminds me of the old joke attributed to Yogi Berra, "nobody goes there anymore- it's too crowded."
- dzhiurgis 4y ago
  How about long distances? Even zooming on ebike it still takes ages, even longer if you are on a bike line, obeying speed limit. Climate is another factor - in a hot weather it’s actually nice to be on ebike (other than sunburn), but rain and cold climates suck. In NL public transport always used to fill up on a bad day.
nroets 4y ago
I'd much rather cycle in busy Amsterdam than drive in congested Los Angeles, Paris, Tbilisi, HCMC etc.
dvko 4y ago
Driving in Amsterdam is much worse than cycling there… But yes, planning a city to support safe cycling while also having decent public transportation is important, I guess. We just need less car centrism.
Vinnl 4y ago
While technically true, there's still so much improvement to be had in flat-enough places that that's basically irrelevant for a while. Cities like London, Berlin or Paris are totally fine for cycling when it comes to flatness, and I'm sure many others that I'm less familiar with are too. And with electric bicycles, even cities like Arnhem are perfectly doable, as long as the infrastructure's up for it.
midoridensha 4y ago
>but my point is: one needs enough flatness to make cycling attractive. No, you don't. You just need a bike with these things called "gears" and "derailleurs", things the Dutch don't seem to believe in. You can also get an e-bike which makes going uphill no more difficult than riding on flat terrain.
- rambambram 4y ago
  Come on, an e-bike is much more like a scooter or a moped. I know it's not black and white, but cycling is getting forward purely on your own strength. Everything else makes you dependent on other things than your own body.
  - akvadrako 4y ago
    E-bikes are importantly much lighter than scooters / mopeds. They also use some of your own power - often about 50%.
    - midoridensha 4y ago
      The e-bikes I've seen seem to basically be made to supply assistance so that the rider feels the same effort, whether they're pedaling on flat land or uphill.

alamortsubite 4y ago

The obstacle to cycling posed by steep hills is being diminished greatly by e-bikes. Unfortunately, the problem with traffic in Amsterdam is not, but I think that only serves to reinforce how attractive bikes are for commuting. It reminds me of the old joke attributed to Yogi Berra, "nobody goes there anymore- it's too crowded."

dzhiurgis 4y ago
How about long distances? Even zooming on ebike it still takes ages, even longer if you are on a bike line, obeying speed limit. Climate is another factor - in a hot weather it’s actually nice to be on ebike (other than sunburn), but rain and cold climates suck. In NL public transport always used to fill up on a bad day.

nroets 4y ago

I'd much rather cycle in busy Amsterdam than drive in congested Los Angeles, Paris, Tbilisi, HCMC etc.

dvko 4y ago

Driving in Amsterdam is much worse than cycling there… But yes, planning a city to support safe cycling while also having decent public transportation is important, I guess. We just need less car centrism.

Vinnl 4y ago

While technically true, there's still so much improvement to be had in flat-enough places that that's basically irrelevant for a while. Cities like London, Berlin or Paris are totally fine for cycling when it comes to flatness, and I'm sure many others that I'm less familiar with are too. And with electric bicycles, even cities like Arnhem are perfectly doable, as long as the infrastructure's up for it.

midoridensha 4y ago

>but my point is: one needs enough flatness to make cycling attractive. No, you don't. You just need a bike with these things called "gears" and "derailleurs", things the Dutch don't seem to believe in. You can also get an e-bike which makes going uphill no more difficult than riding on flat terrain.

rambambram 4y ago
Come on, an e-bike is much more like a scooter or a moped. I know it's not black and white, but cycling is getting forward purely on your own strength. Everything else makes you dependent on other things than your own body.
- akvadrako 4y ago
  E-bikes are importantly much lighter than scooters / mopeds. They also use some of your own power - often about 50%.
  - midoridensha 4y ago
    The e-bikes I've seen seem to basically be made to supply assistance so that the rider feels the same effort, whether they're pedaling on flat land or uphill.