5 ms·

> In the early 90's we thought the net would change the world, but what actually happened is the world changed the net. To me it seems to be a bit of both? BT

by csdvrx 4y ago

> In the early 90's we thought the net would change the world, but what actually happened is the world changed the net. To me it seems to be a bit of both? BTW having read a bit of your other comments, I find your analyses both insightful and introspective. You seem to be from the EU and to have worked in tech during the 1990s. Have you lived in the US too? Can you tell me more about how you saw things change in the US and the EU from then to know? I have some weird interest in old tech: hardware like Thinkpads, software like Perl... but the culture is also very foreign and interesting. I just watched a documentary about "Dinosaurs" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dinosaurs_(TV_series) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dinosaurs_(TV_series) and it seems so modern yet quaint? I want to know more from the viewpoint of someone who lived in that era!

082349872349872 4y ago
Well, that's a big question; hope you don't mind if I reflect a bit before attempting to answer! (any specific qs, go ahead and I'll do my best) I was living in the US in the 80s and 90s (among which, both in Silicon Valley and in "flyover" country, with non-domicile tours in Boston, Seattle, and the DC Beltway) Have you read Microserfs yet? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microserfs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microserfs It's a pretty good capture of our Zeitgeist. In fact, I distinctly remember one day when I was at my desk, and two of my colleagues were enjoying the afternoon sun on the balcony of my office. We had started to discuss Microserfs, through the open window next to my desk, and one of them remarked: "it's pretty accurate ... except they're all dating within the company". One year or so later, the company had grown by a factor of two or three, and it turns out Coupland had indeed called it in advance: all three of us were then in intra-company relationships. (which was again, a topic of balcony discussion) (sorry, no idea about Dinosaurs: we were working extreme hours [some days the company was comping us ~$2'000/day (in 2023 USD), which was considered very good money back then for "kids" not many years out of uni], and except for attending watch parties for Simpsons, Beavis & Butthead, and Spike & Mike's when it came through town, I was not getting much pop culture exposure during these years) Another anecdote: our landlord once complained that the janitor had found porno mags in the restrooms, and as the other tenants were law firms, maybe they might have been from us, possibly one of our contractors? My boss, indignant, called them up and she asked them if they knew we were an internet company? With a T1 connection? How could they possibly think any of us would still be paying for porn on dead trees?
- csdvrx 4y ago
  > Well, that's a big question; hope you don't mind if I reflect a bit before attempting to answer! Not at all, please take your time! And if you have more insights, feel free to post them later! I'll check again the comments for the next few days, because all this is so intriguing to me! > I was living in the US in the 80s and 90s This begs many questions: where you born here? Where do you live now? (and ...why?) > Have you read Microserfs yet? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microserfs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microserfs > It's a pretty good capture of our Zeitgeist I haven't but if it's a good capture of the 1990s zeitgeist, I will! > (any specific qs, go ahead and I'll do my best) Besides the lack of optimism, what are the other differences between now and then that stand out to you?
  - 082349872349872 4y ago
    I was born in the Southern US (long story: when a cat has its kittens in the oven...) but emigrated to Europe this century (reasons for which are an even longer story). > what are the other differences between now and then that stand out to you? It may not be so fair to 'now', but: https://app.pressnt.net/post/77/ https://app.pressnt.net/post/77/ (thanks for making me think about it long enough to come up with a hypothesis; I think I do address both the things about current startup culture which I find off-putting, and —if you read between the lines a bit— why we might've preferred power to safety in our tools.) Lagniappe: https://users.monash.edu/~damian/papers/HTML/Perligata.html https://users.monash.edu/~damian/papers/HTML/Perligata.html
  - 082349872349872 4y ago
    another thought on why power languages then but not now: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32623328 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32623328
082349872349872 4y ago
> ...and [Dinosaurs] seems so modern yet quaint? Q for you: anything in particular that was modern yet quaint? CRTs? phones?

by csdvrx 4y ago

082349872349872 4y ago

Well, that's a big question; hope you don't mind if I reflect a bit before attempting to answer! (any specific qs, go ahead and I'll do my best) I was living in the US in the 80s and 90s (among which, both in Silicon Valley and in "flyover" country, with non-domicile tours in Boston, Seattle, and the DC Beltway) Have you read Microserfs yet? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microserfs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microserfs It's a pretty good capture of our Zeitgeist. In fact, I distinctly remember one day when I was at my desk, and two of my colleagues were enjoying the afternoon sun on the balcony of my office. We had started to discuss Microserfs, through the open window next to my desk, and one of them remarked: "it's pretty accurate ... except they're all dating within the company". One year or so later, the company had grown by a factor of two or three, and it turns out Coupland had indeed called it in advance: all three of us were then in intra-company relationships. (which was again, a topic of balcony discussion) (sorry, no idea about Dinosaurs: we were working extreme hours [some days the company was comping us ~$2'000/day (in 2023 USD), which was considered very good money back then for "kids" not many years out of uni], and except for attending watch parties for Simpsons, Beavis & Butthead, and Spike & Mike's when it came through town, I was not getting much pop culture exposure during these years) Another anecdote: our landlord once complained that the janitor had found porno mags in the restrooms, and as the other tenants were law firms, maybe they might have been from us, possibly one of our contractors? My boss, indignant, called them up and she asked them if they knew we were an internet company? With a T1 connection? How could they possibly think any of us would still be paying for porn on dead trees?

csdvrx 4y ago
> Well, that's a big question; hope you don't mind if I reflect a bit before attempting to answer! Not at all, please take your time! And if you have more insights, feel free to post them later! I'll check again the comments for the next few days, because all this is so intriguing to me! > I was living in the US in the 80s and 90s This begs many questions: where you born here? Where do you live now? (and ...why?) > Have you read Microserfs yet? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microserfs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microserfs > It's a pretty good capture of our Zeitgeist I haven't but if it's a good capture of the 1990s zeitgeist, I will! > (any specific qs, go ahead and I'll do my best) Besides the lack of optimism, what are the other differences between now and then that stand out to you?
- 082349872349872 4y ago
  I was born in the Southern US (long story: when a cat has its kittens in the oven...) but emigrated to Europe this century (reasons for which are an even longer story). > what are the other differences between now and then that stand out to you? It may not be so fair to 'now', but: https://app.pressnt.net/post/77/ https://app.pressnt.net/post/77/ (thanks for making me think about it long enough to come up with a hypothesis; I think I do address both the things about current startup culture which I find off-putting, and —if you read between the lines a bit— why we might've preferred power to safety in our tools.) Lagniappe: https://users.monash.edu/~damian/papers/HTML/Perligata.html https://users.monash.edu/~damian/papers/HTML/Perligata.html
- 082349872349872 4y ago
  another thought on why power languages then but not now: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32623328 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32623328

082349872349872 4y ago

> ...and [Dinosaurs] seems so modern yet quaint? Q for you: anything in particular that was modern yet quaint? CRTs? phones?