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"painted and engraved non-figurative signs from at least ~42,000 BP and figurative images (notably animals) from at least 37,000 BP" At least so far, no one ha

"painted and engraved non-figurative signs from at least ~42,000 BP and figurative images (notably animals) from at least 37,000 BP" At least so far, no one has found any DNA trace of these people among modern Europeans. At least for now, it seems these Homo Sapiens went extinct the same time that the Neanderthals went extinct. Europe was re-populated around 15,000 years ago by a group that expanded from Anatolia. This group has left a DNA trace that still exists in modern Europeans. But at least for now, it is not clear that modern Europeans have any ancestry that goes back to 40,000 BC. https://marketbusinessnews.com/dramatic-population-change-in-europe-15000-years-ago-dna-evidence-shows/123592/ https://marketbusinessnews.com/dramatic-population-change-in...

PaulRobinson 4y ago
Europeans have ancestry have that goes back beyond 40000 BC. The article you link to states: "Genetic data about early modern humans who existed for up to 40,000 years as hunter-gatherers in Europe is scarce, while their population dynamics and structure is virtually unknown." I think what you meant then, is that European ancestry has not been fully understood or explained, otherwise your statement suggests Europeans were beamed here from an alien planet ~42k years ago, and that they are not genetically descended from the same roots as other humans - quite a claim, if that's what you're suggesting. Hate to be pedantic, but small words have big meaning in this context.
- lkrubner 4y ago
  This sentence is either incoherent or directly contradicted by the article that I linked to: "Europeans have ancestry have that goes back beyond 40000 BC" I cannot figure out what you mean, but I think you misunderstood what I wrote. The article that I linked to says that, of the European DNA that has been captured from samples from 40,000 years ago, no trace of the DNA can be found in the modern population, therefore it seems the Homo Sapiens who were alive in Europe 40,000 years ago eventually went extinct. There was a dramatic change in the DNA in human samples found from 15,000 years ago, and this DNA is found in modern populations. Therefore, the early populations of Europe were wiped out, and replaced by the new populations that arrived 15,000 years ago. It is believed that there were human populations that expanded from Anatolia and which spread across Europe 15,000 years ago. Based on the DNA evidence, this new population completely replaced earlier populations. None of the earlier populations survived, since none of their DNA is found in modern populations. You wrote: "otherwise your statement suggests Europeans were beamed here from an alien planet ~42k years ago" I wrote: "Europe was re-populated around 15,000 years ago by a group that expanded from Anatolia." I think it is more likely that the new population came from Anatolia. This is easier to believe than thinking that the new population came from an alien planet.
  - KMag 4y ago
    I think a minimally modified "steel man" version of the contended statement is that _modern_ Europeans don't have any _European_ ancestry that goes back beyond 40,000 BC. Their ancestry is known further back; it's just not in Europe. A literal reading of the contended statement is that the ancestry trail of Modern Europeans disappears before 40,000 BC (hence the other poster's comments about aliens), implying no trace back to Anatolia 15,000 years ago, or Africa some 300,000 years ago. I think you meant to state that the family trees of modern Europeans aren't known to have any branches _within_Europe_ in 40,000 BC.

PaulRobinson 4y ago

Europeans have ancestry have that goes back beyond 40000 BC. The article you link to states: "Genetic data about early modern humans who existed for up to 40,000 years as hunter-gatherers in Europe is scarce, while their population dynamics and structure is virtually unknown." I think what you meant then, is that European ancestry has not been fully understood or explained, otherwise your statement suggests Europeans were beamed here from an alien planet ~42k years ago, and that they are not genetically descended from the same roots as other humans - quite a claim, if that's what you're suggesting. Hate to be pedantic, but small words have big meaning in this context.

lkrubner 4y ago
This sentence is either incoherent or directly contradicted by the article that I linked to: "Europeans have ancestry have that goes back beyond 40000 BC" I cannot figure out what you mean, but I think you misunderstood what I wrote. The article that I linked to says that, of the European DNA that has been captured from samples from 40,000 years ago, no trace of the DNA can be found in the modern population, therefore it seems the Homo Sapiens who were alive in Europe 40,000 years ago eventually went extinct. There was a dramatic change in the DNA in human samples found from 15,000 years ago, and this DNA is found in modern populations. Therefore, the early populations of Europe were wiped out, and replaced by the new populations that arrived 15,000 years ago. It is believed that there were human populations that expanded from Anatolia and which spread across Europe 15,000 years ago. Based on the DNA evidence, this new population completely replaced earlier populations. None of the earlier populations survived, since none of their DNA is found in modern populations. You wrote: "otherwise your statement suggests Europeans were beamed here from an alien planet ~42k years ago" I wrote: "Europe was re-populated around 15,000 years ago by a group that expanded from Anatolia." I think it is more likely that the new population came from Anatolia. This is easier to believe than thinking that the new population came from an alien planet.
- KMag 4y ago
  I think a minimally modified "steel man" version of the contended statement is that _modern_ Europeans don't have any _European_ ancestry that goes back beyond 40,000 BC. Their ancestry is known further back; it's just not in Europe. A literal reading of the contended statement is that the ancestry trail of Modern Europeans disappears before 40,000 BC (hence the other poster's comments about aliens), implying no trace back to Anatolia 15,000 years ago, or Africa some 300,000 years ago. I think you meant to state that the family trees of modern Europeans aren't known to have any branches _within_Europe_ in 40,000 BC.