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The Church and Utah governments are also the biggest waster there too. That is also political. The whole messaging around this is disingenuous. Urban water usa

The Church and Utah governments are also the biggest waster there too. That is also political. The whole messaging around this is disingenuous. Urban water usage is a small subset, and even within that category individual citizens are a small subset, but yet most of the PR/"make changes" have been focused on a minority of a minority.

lost_tourist 4y ago
It's a literal "solve the 90% problem first" but right wing people like to blame democrats pointing with one finger while pocketing cash from their industrial, eco-killing practices with the other hand. That's the way it has always been. They will have enough money to move out of Utah when it goes dry. The other 99% who were dumb enough to be duped by them will suffer and starve.
s1artibartfast 4y ago
The focus is on the Urban water users because they are the ones that are facing the problem and need a solution. They can do that either by reducing water usage or procuring more water.
- Someone1234 4y ago
  Urban users cannot reduce water usage enough to solve the problem.
  - s1artibartfast 4y ago
    I think that is debatable. A lot of urban water is wasted on lawns, pools, and parks. It is not unthinkable that it could be reduced by 25-50% per person if you banned these things. Church and government water use you mention also fall under the control of the urban governments. That said, there is always the 2nd option of purchasing more water.
    - masklinn 4y ago
      > I think that is debatable. It's not. Saving the great salt lake requires a water consumption reduction larger than total urban consumption in Utah. You can't get 1.5 million acre-feet out of a box which contains half a million. > A lot of urban water is wasted on lawns, pools, and parks. It is not unthinkable that it could be reduced by 25-50% per person if you banned these things. That's literally pulled out of your ass with no supporting evidence, and even if it were true it'd still be nowhere near what's needed. > That said, there is always the 2nd option of purchasing more water. No there is not always the option of purchasing the thing everyone lacks.
      - s1artibartfast 4y ago
        I think we are talking about two different subjects. I was talking about ensuring enough water for urban users to live and you are talking about maintaining the great salt lake. This seems to be the confusion.
        thebooktocome 4y ago
        Maintaining the Great Salt Lake is the topic of the article.
        s1artibartfast 4y ago
        Yes, but much of the discussion is of urban vs agricultural usage, and which group should bear the burden.
- masklinn 4y ago
  Urban utahn are not "the ones that are facing" the loss of the great salt lake. The state is.
  - s1artibartfast 4y ago
    In terms of the salt lake, I think you are right. In terms of access for urban use, I think it is their problem to solve.
- toofy 4y ago
  > The focus is on the Urban water users because they are the ones that are facing the problem they are facing _the repercussions_ of a problem largely caused by someone else.
  - malandrew 4y ago
    They did cause it by moving there and building a life there (including building their gardens). If the city had remained a small backwater town, this problem wouldn’t exist because the farms are 75% and the 25% consumed by the city today would end up as surplus each year replenishing water supplies. The farms predate all the new usage. The new usage from urbanization caused the deficit.
    - s1artibartfast 4y ago
      Alternatively, Farms would use 100% of the water, the lake would go dry, and the population would largely accept it as a necessity to maintain their agricultural usage.

lost_tourist 4y ago

It's a literal "solve the 90% problem first" but right wing people like to blame democrats pointing with one finger while pocketing cash from their industrial, eco-killing practices with the other hand. That's the way it has always been. They will have enough money to move out of Utah when it goes dry. The other 99% who were dumb enough to be duped by them will suffer and starve.

s1artibartfast 4y ago

The focus is on the Urban water users because they are the ones that are facing the problem and need a solution. They can do that either by reducing water usage or procuring more water.

Someone1234 4y ago
Urban users cannot reduce water usage enough to solve the problem.
- s1artibartfast 4y ago
  I think that is debatable. A lot of urban water is wasted on lawns, pools, and parks. It is not unthinkable that it could be reduced by 25-50% per person if you banned these things. Church and government water use you mention also fall under the control of the urban governments. That said, there is always the 2nd option of purchasing more water.
  - masklinn 4y ago
    > I think that is debatable. It's not. Saving the great salt lake requires a water consumption reduction larger than total urban consumption in Utah. You can't get 1.5 million acre-feet out of a box which contains half a million. > A lot of urban water is wasted on lawns, pools, and parks. It is not unthinkable that it could be reduced by 25-50% per person if you banned these things. That's literally pulled out of your ass with no supporting evidence, and even if it were true it'd still be nowhere near what's needed. > That said, there is always the 2nd option of purchasing more water. No there is not always the option of purchasing the thing everyone lacks.
    - s1artibartfast 4y ago
      I think we are talking about two different subjects. I was talking about ensuring enough water for urban users to live and you are talking about maintaining the great salt lake. This seems to be the confusion.
      - thebooktocome 4y ago
        Maintaining the Great Salt Lake is the topic of the article.
        s1artibartfast 4y ago
        Yes, but much of the discussion is of urban vs agricultural usage, and which group should bear the burden.
masklinn 4y ago
Urban utahn are not "the ones that are facing" the loss of the great salt lake. The state is.
- s1artibartfast 4y ago
  In terms of the salt lake, I think you are right. In terms of access for urban use, I think it is their problem to solve.
toofy 4y ago
> The focus is on the Urban water users because they are the ones that are facing the problem they are facing _the repercussions_ of a problem largely caused by someone else.
- malandrew 4y ago
  They did cause it by moving there and building a life there (including building their gardens). If the city had remained a small backwater town, this problem wouldn’t exist because the farms are 75% and the 25% consumed by the city today would end up as surplus each year replenishing water supplies. The farms predate all the new usage. The new usage from urbanization caused the deficit.
  - s1artibartfast 4y ago
    Alternatively, Farms would use 100% of the water, the lake would go dry, and the population would largely accept it as a necessity to maintain their agricultural usage.