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The point is – k8s essentially simplifies the solution, so what you'd get up and running will serve you for the time being without any maintenance. You're talki

by gloosx 4y ago

The point is – k8s essentially simplifies the solution, so what you'd get up and running will serve you for the time being without any maintenance. You're talking about it like it's a whole different framework of thinking which you will need to adopt from scratch, but it's not. Containerisation and virtualisation concepts are here since the beginning of time, just this thing makes it real easy to grasp, apart from that it is all same technology. It literally allows anyone to spin-up amazing production clusters quickly with zero overhead – assuming you know what you're spinning up, something that just took months of configuration works – now abstracted to few funny .yaml files.

danjac 4y ago
There's literally a web site of Kubernetes failure stories: https://k8s.af/ https://k8s.af/ where people experienced in Kubernetes have shot themselves in the foot. To be fair, it's over a year old, and probably the state of the art and best practices have advanced to the point where many of these are unlikely to happen. But in general, Kubernetes is widely considered a very big complex thing full of footguns for the unwary for a reason. So while I agree with you that sure, you can get up and running by watching some videos and copy-pasting a few YAML files, the problem is when you are deep into critical production and you run into issues (the classic "I get woken up at 3am by an alert or my boss and we need to fix this in 10 minutes") and you lack the deeper understanding of the framework to even know where to start. Or even worse, you insert an insidious security issue through a misconfiguration and you are not even aware you have been owned. Security is notoriously difficult to get right, even for people with experience in frameworks and systems, let alone a newbie. Kubernetes is not "secure by default" and again, there are footguns for the unwary: https://snyk.io/learn/kubernetes-security/ https://snyk.io/learn/kubernetes-security/ None of these things make Kubernetes bad, per se, and I'm sure the benefits outweigh the costs. But personally I would be cautious about adopting it for serious production without having some solid real-world experience first. There's a bigger question here as well, regarding small teams (as in startups, not just pizza teams in a tech giant). Where do you want your very limited time and focus to be? If I'm building some SAAS application I want to put my coding focus close to 100% towards the business model. If that model requires me learning new tech then fine, but otherwise it's a case of "use what you know", because new tech that isn't focused on that is going to waste my precious time and resources down the line.

by gloosx 4y ago

danjac 4y ago

There's literally a web site of Kubernetes failure stories: https://k8s.af/ https://k8s.af/ where people experienced in Kubernetes have shot themselves in the foot. To be fair, it's over a year old, and probably the state of the art and best practices have advanced to the point where many of these are unlikely to happen. But in general, Kubernetes is widely considered a very big complex thing full of footguns for the unwary for a reason. So while I agree with you that sure, you can get up and running by watching some videos and copy-pasting a few YAML files, the problem is when you are deep into critical production and you run into issues (the classic "I get woken up at 3am by an alert or my boss and we need to fix this in 10 minutes") and you lack the deeper understanding of the framework to even know where to start. Or even worse, you insert an insidious security issue through a misconfiguration and you are not even aware you have been owned. Security is notoriously difficult to get right, even for people with experience in frameworks and systems, let alone a newbie. Kubernetes is not "secure by default" and again, there are footguns for the unwary: https://snyk.io/learn/kubernetes-security/ https://snyk.io/learn/kubernetes-security/ None of these things make Kubernetes bad, per se, and I'm sure the benefits outweigh the costs. But personally I would be cautious about adopting it for serious production without having some solid real-world experience first. There's a bigger question here as well, regarding small teams (as in startups, not just pizza teams in a tech giant). Where do you want your very limited time and focus to be? If I'm building some SAAS application I want to put my coding focus close to 100% towards the business model. If that model requires me learning new tech then fine, but otherwise it's a case of "use what you know", because new tech that isn't focused on that is going to waste my precious time and resources down the line.