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Meta Ireland fined €390M for GDPR infringement

64 points by zsiciarz 4y ago

traveler01 4y ago
Meta, one of the few companies where its worth it to enforce GDPR.
nequo 4y ago
TL;DR: When GDPR came into effect in 2018, Facebook and Instagram changed from asking for consent to use personal data to requiring that users enter into a contract with the company. The Data Protection Commission is siding with the complainants who say that making the service conditional on agreeing to the contract is the same as forcing users to consent.
- lopis 4y ago
  And this case is successful, we might see real repercussions this time around, instead of a wave of cookie banners. On the other hand, we might also see way more websites willing to straight-out block EU users from accessing them. And they won't be missed.
  - nequo 4y ago
    Blocking a market of 447 million people simply because you need to ask them to click "agree" before you use their personal data (which most people do anyway) sounds like a bad business decision.
    - lopis 4y ago
      And yet several companies did exactly that in 2018 after GDPR started being enforced in Europe.
      - nequo 4y ago
        Do you have examples? Wikipedia[1] only mentions these: Instapaper (restored service in the EU in August 2018) Unroll.Me Klout (went defunct in 2018) The Chicago Tribune (local newspaper) The Los Angeles Times (local newspaper) [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Data_Protection_Regulation#Impact https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Data_Protection_Regula...
  - miroljub 4y ago
    As an EU citizen, I'll be happy if Meta would block me everywhere. Then I won't have to fiddle with various ad blocker and tracking blocker settings to make sure they are not getting anything from me.
macintux 4y ago
Discussed yesterday: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34246215 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34246215
- singularity2001 4y ago
  For those only reading the title it's news
tempodox 4y ago
Good to see fines that aren't just symbolic small change. As another commenter noted yesterday, “Give it another tenfold increase and I'm content.”
bgidley 4y ago
It's been pretty clear from all the guidence (e.g https://ico.org.uk/for-organisations/guide-to-data-protection/guide-to-the-general-data-protection-regulation-gdpr/consent/what-is-valid-consent/ https://ico.org.uk/for-organisations/guide-to-data-protectio...) issued around GDPR 'forced consent' would not work - Facebook decided to try and push the limits and now have a massive fine. What's slightly surprising is how long it's taken to get to the massive fines stage.
- traveler01 4y ago
  For the amount of profit Meta makes this isn't such a big fine.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
School-Cotton 4y ago
Totally off-topic, but I always find it a bit sad how Ireland pays lip service to Irish being their first official language (note that the Irish-language name in their logo is bold and on top) but in reality it is a nearly 100% English-speaking country (note that this press release was published in English, and the link to the Irish version of the page doesn't work). Really demoralizing, if you care about language preservation, to see how difficult it is even in a very rich country with major cultural and political reasons to want to preserve a language, and which expends significant resources doing so. Now think of all the obscure languages around the world and how impossible it is for them to survive long term.
- colmmacc 4y ago
  Definitely off-topic but I wouldn't be so sad. I grew up speaking Irish at home and at school, and at the time that was very uncommon outside of a Gaeltacht. Now there are many many more Irish speaking schools, just in the area I grew up my nieces and nephew had 5 different options, 2 within walking distance. I had a 30 minute bus ride to get to one option. This year there will be 3 Irish-language TV stations (Tg4, Naught, and a new one focused on kids) ... and Irish cultural centers are strong. When I go home to Ireland, even in Dublin I can socialize and go out in Irish; Áras Chrónáin is our local. Irish feels much stronger to me than in the 80s.
  - themitigating 4y ago
    It's probably dangerous economically to change from English as a primary language to Irish. I'm sure there's an argument for culture but those are subjective and often backed with emotions
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- easytiger 4y ago
  Why is it demoralising? The language would be near on dead if it weren't used as part of the State Creation / nationalism techniques used post 1920s. There are many dozens of other such languages in similar states of decline in Europe. e.g. Yiddish https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_endangered_languages_in_Europe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_endangered_languages_i...
bluelu 4y ago
And meanwhile, all the big newspapers in germany ask you to consent to individual tracking (and sharing to third parties) whenever you access their websites. Since they are not Meta, it seems to be completely acceptable. (Example: https://www.spiegel.de/ https://www.spiegel.de/)
- yrro 4y ago
  Are you saying that they force users to consent in order to access the sites, or are you making a totally ridiculous comparison?
  - olivierduval 4y ago
    The Spiegel home page shows - as a lot of other newspapers - either "subscribe to read ad free" or "read with ads and your datas will be sold"... Actually, it's the best way for me to stop reading some newspaper... In fact, less and less newspaper allow you to disagree to tracking and show only standard ads
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
- izacus 4y ago
  Yeah, most of my GDPR complaints for some egregious behaviour just went to /dev/null (I guess because they were about local telecom and service companies, important for national interest). GDPR seems to be more and more about getting handouts from US companies and lacks an effective enforcement path for smaller violators.
  - sofixa 4y ago
    How do you know that your complaints were ignored? The regulators in charge of enforcing GDPR are famously understaffed, some with multi-year backlogs.
- ArnoVW 4y ago
macinjosh 4y ago
Sounds like meta would be better off blocking the whole continent. Their services are obviously not desired there.
rhn_mk1 4y ago
What does that mean for websites which offer an alternative between ads and a paid subscription?

64 points by zsiciarz 4y ago

Meta, one of the few companies where its worth it to enforce GDPR.

TL;DR: When GDPR came into effect in 2018, Facebook and Instagram changed from asking for consent to use personal data to requiring that users enter into a contract with the company. The Data Protection Commission is siding with the complainants who say that making the service conditional on agreeing to the contract is the same as forcing users to consent.

lopis 4y ago
And this case is successful, we might see real repercussions this time around, instead of a wave of cookie banners. On the other hand, we might also see way more websites willing to straight-out block EU users from accessing them. And they won't be missed.
- nequo 4y ago
  Blocking a market of 447 million people simply because you need to ask them to click "agree" before you use their personal data (which most people do anyway) sounds like a bad business decision.
  - lopis 4y ago
    And yet several companies did exactly that in 2018 after GDPR started being enforced in Europe.
    - nequo 4y ago
      Do you have examples? Wikipedia[1] only mentions these: Instapaper (restored service in the EU in August 2018) Unroll.Me Klout (went defunct in 2018) The Chicago Tribune (local newspaper) The Los Angeles Times (local newspaper) [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Data_Protection_Regulation#Impact https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Data_Protection_Regula...
- miroljub 4y ago
  As an EU citizen, I'll be happy if Meta would block me everywhere. Then I won't have to fiddle with various ad blocker and tracking blocker settings to make sure they are not getting anything from me.

macintux 4y ago

Discussed yesterday: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34246215 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34246215

singularity2001 4y ago
For those only reading the title it's news

tempodox 4y ago

Good to see fines that aren't just symbolic small change. As another commenter noted yesterday, “Give it another tenfold increase and I'm content.”

bgidley 4y ago

It's been pretty clear from all the guidence (e.g https://ico.org.uk/for-organisations/guide-to-data-protection/guide-to-the-general-data-protection-regulation-gdpr/consent/what-is-valid-consent/ https://ico.org.uk/for-organisations/guide-to-data-protectio...) issued around GDPR 'forced consent' would not work - Facebook decided to try and push the limits and now have a massive fine. What's slightly surprising is how long it's taken to get to the massive fines stage.

traveler01 4y ago
For the amount of profit Meta makes this isn't such a big fine.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

School-Cotton 4y ago

Totally off-topic, but I always find it a bit sad how Ireland pays lip service to Irish being their first official language (note that the Irish-language name in their logo is bold and on top) but in reality it is a nearly 100% English-speaking country (note that this press release was published in English, and the link to the Irish version of the page doesn't work). Really demoralizing, if you care about language preservation, to see how difficult it is even in a very rich country with major cultural and political reasons to want to preserve a language, and which expends significant resources doing so. Now think of all the obscure languages around the world and how impossible it is for them to survive long term.

colmmacc 4y ago
Definitely off-topic but I wouldn't be so sad. I grew up speaking Irish at home and at school, and at the time that was very uncommon outside of a Gaeltacht. Now there are many many more Irish speaking schools, just in the area I grew up my nieces and nephew had 5 different options, 2 within walking distance. I had a 30 minute bus ride to get to one option. This year there will be 3 Irish-language TV stations (Tg4, Naught, and a new one focused on kids) ... and Irish cultural centers are strong. When I go home to Ireland, even in Dublin I can socialize and go out in Irish; Áras Chrónáin is our local. Irish feels much stronger to me than in the 80s.
- themitigating 4y ago
  It's probably dangerous economically to change from English as a primary language to Irish. I'm sure there's an argument for culture but those are subjective and often backed with emotions
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
easytiger 4y ago
Why is it demoralising? The language would be near on dead if it weren't used as part of the State Creation / nationalism techniques used post 1920s. There are many dozens of other such languages in similar states of decline in Europe. e.g. Yiddish https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_endangered_languages_in_Europe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_endangered_languages_i...

bluelu 4y ago

And meanwhile, all the big newspapers in germany ask you to consent to individual tracking (and sharing to third parties) whenever you access their websites. Since they are not Meta, it seems to be completely acceptable. (Example: https://www.spiegel.de/ https://www.spiegel.de/)

yrro 4y ago
Are you saying that they force users to consent in order to access the sites, or are you making a totally ridiculous comparison?
- olivierduval 4y ago
  The Spiegel home page shows - as a lot of other newspapers - either "subscribe to read ad free" or "read with ads and your datas will be sold"... Actually, it's the best way for me to stop reading some newspaper... In fact, less and less newspaper allow you to disagree to tracking and show only standard ads
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
izacus 4y ago
Yeah, most of my GDPR complaints for some egregious behaviour just went to /dev/null (I guess because they were about local telecom and service companies, important for national interest). GDPR seems to be more and more about getting handouts from US companies and lacks an effective enforcement path for smaller violators.
- sofixa 4y ago
  How do you know that your complaints were ignored? The regulators in charge of enforcing GDPR are famously understaffed, some with multi-year backlogs.
ArnoVW 4y ago

macinjosh 4y ago

Sounds like meta would be better off blocking the whole continent. Their services are obviously not desired there.

rhn_mk1 4y ago

What does that mean for websites which offer an alternative between ads and a paid subscription?