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What if the city added batteries instead of plows? Have recharging stations that swapped batteries. Requires building the plows around hot swappable batteries

What if the city added batteries instead of plows? Have recharging stations that swapped batteries. Requires building the plows around hot swappable batteries and a station with some fixed hydraulics that can drop them in and out. Requires a bit of redundancy by having multiple stations to swap batteries and something like forklifts to drag them around and charge the spent batteries. Probably not a good consumer solution, but this is an industry, so industrial solutions would work fine.

mike_d 4y ago
What if we had some type of fluid that carried potential energy that we could quickly pour into a giant tank on the trucks? Some things will just never go electric. Like fire trucks, ambulances, tow trucks, power company trucks, etc. that have to be able to function for weeks at a time in a grid down situation. Dead dinosaurs are the best answer for some problems, just not every car on the road.
- cogman10 4y ago
  > fire trucks Would be excellent EVs. They have super low millage and you'd not have to worry about things like stagnant fuel. > ambulances Generally low mileage vehicles, no idea why you'd not be able to use them as EVs. > tow trucks Perhaps the only one that would be bad given the amount of power required to tow a vehicle. > power company trucks Excellent option for EVs because they almost never haul equipment and they are always working on electrical things. > that have to be able to function for weeks at a time in a grid down situation. Generators are a thing that pretty much every one of these services will have. Because you can't have a fire station, EMT dispatch, etc go dark because of a grid down situation. And, consider this when thinking of a "grid down" situation. How do you pump fuel if the grid is down? There are few places where EVs are bad fits. The main ones are airplanes and ships where getting power is hard and the power density needs to be high. For everything semi-truck and smaller, batteries have a high enough capacity to service today.
  - RhysU 4y ago
    Are you serious?! If my town loses power for two weeks I want fire trucks, ambulances, tow trucks, and especially power company trucks to work! Civic infrastructure should anticipate tail events. > How do you pump fuel if the grid is down? Gravity. Siphons. Manual pumps. Etc. Real complicated stuff known since figuratively Roman times.
    - cogman10 4y ago
      > Generators are a thing that pretty much every one of these services will have. Because you can't have a fire station, EMT dispatch, etc go dark because of a grid down situation.
      - RhysU 4y ago
        "Shouldn't" and "can't" are different things. I can power a couple of radios with far less than a full generator.
        the_mar 4y ago
        what if i told you, you still need to charge ur fire truck
        RhysU 4y ago
        Alternators won't do it?
        catiopatio 4y ago
        The (very large) alternator will power the onboard electrical systems and charge the chassis/equipment batteries while the engine is running. When sitting in a truck bay, there’s a shore line providing mains power to keep everything charged — we’re generally talking a 10-16A draw. That’s easily met with a small generator, as opposed to the insane power draw a full EV battery would require.
- marssaxman 4y ago
  > Some things will just never go electric. And yet they will have to, if we want to continue having a civilization...
the-rc 4y ago
There are many stations already, every few blocks. And the company running them, Citibike, already wants to connect them to the grid. Now you have a more tractable problem: when there's snow coming, some of the (many) unused bike racks can be dedicated to recharge truck batteries instead. I don't know what the hydraulics would look like and if that's something that can be installed seasonally or perhaps just a few days in advance.
- lamontcg 4y ago
  I'm assuming the trucks are parked somewhere in depot(s) so you'd probably put the infrastructure there to swap them out and charge them.
  - the-rc 4y ago
    There are many more bike stations than truck depots. You could conceivably swap batteries multiple times during a 12h shift without having to make detours. And if you know there's going to be a lot of plowing, you could place batteries throughout the city ahead of time. Heavy storms rarely show up without warning signs. Elsewhere I suggested stockpiling batteries from other non-essential vehicles, so you don't need excessive redundant capacity that sits idle 95% of the year. That's why repurposing bike stations could help: you're not stuck with a lot of infrastructure that is needed only 5% of the year.
- lazide 4y ago
  Uh, those bike racks have nowhere near the infrastructure required to charge huge truck battery packs. You can’t be serious?

mike_d 4y ago

What if we had some type of fluid that carried potential energy that we could quickly pour into a giant tank on the trucks? Some things will just never go electric. Like fire trucks, ambulances, tow trucks, power company trucks, etc. that have to be able to function for weeks at a time in a grid down situation. Dead dinosaurs are the best answer for some problems, just not every car on the road.

cogman10 4y ago
> fire trucks Would be excellent EVs. They have super low millage and you'd not have to worry about things like stagnant fuel. > ambulances Generally low mileage vehicles, no idea why you'd not be able to use them as EVs. > tow trucks Perhaps the only one that would be bad given the amount of power required to tow a vehicle. > power company trucks Excellent option for EVs because they almost never haul equipment and they are always working on electrical things. > that have to be able to function for weeks at a time in a grid down situation. Generators are a thing that pretty much every one of these services will have. Because you can't have a fire station, EMT dispatch, etc go dark because of a grid down situation. And, consider this when thinking of a "grid down" situation. How do you pump fuel if the grid is down? There are few places where EVs are bad fits. The main ones are airplanes and ships where getting power is hard and the power density needs to be high. For everything semi-truck and smaller, batteries have a high enough capacity to service today.
- RhysU 4y ago
  Are you serious?! If my town loses power for two weeks I want fire trucks, ambulances, tow trucks, and especially power company trucks to work! Civic infrastructure should anticipate tail events. > How do you pump fuel if the grid is down? Gravity. Siphons. Manual pumps. Etc. Real complicated stuff known since figuratively Roman times.
  - cogman10 4y ago
    > Generators are a thing that pretty much every one of these services will have. Because you can't have a fire station, EMT dispatch, etc go dark because of a grid down situation.
    - RhysU 4y ago
      "Shouldn't" and "can't" are different things. I can power a couple of radios with far less than a full generator.
      - the_mar 4y ago
        what if i told you, you still need to charge ur fire truck
        RhysU 4y ago
        Alternators won't do it?
        catiopatio 4y ago
        The (very large) alternator will power the onboard electrical systems and charge the chassis/equipment batteries while the engine is running. When sitting in a truck bay, there’s a shore line providing mains power to keep everything charged — we’re generally talking a 10-16A draw. That’s easily met with a small generator, as opposed to the insane power draw a full EV battery would require.
marssaxman 4y ago
> Some things will just never go electric. And yet they will have to, if we want to continue having a civilization...

the-rc 4y ago

There are many stations already, every few blocks. And the company running them, Citibike, already wants to connect them to the grid. Now you have a more tractable problem: when there's snow coming, some of the (many) unused bike racks can be dedicated to recharge truck batteries instead. I don't know what the hydraulics would look like and if that's something that can be installed seasonally or perhaps just a few days in advance.

lamontcg 4y ago
I'm assuming the trucks are parked somewhere in depot(s) so you'd probably put the infrastructure there to swap them out and charge them.
- the-rc 4y ago
  There are many more bike stations than truck depots. You could conceivably swap batteries multiple times during a 12h shift without having to make detours. And if you know there's going to be a lot of plowing, you could place batteries throughout the city ahead of time. Heavy storms rarely show up without warning signs. Elsewhere I suggested stockpiling batteries from other non-essential vehicles, so you don't need excessive redundant capacity that sits idle 95% of the year. That's why repurposing bike stations could help: you're not stuck with a lot of infrastructure that is needed only 5% of the year.
lazide 4y ago
Uh, those bike racks have nowhere near the infrastructure required to charge huge truck battery packs. You can’t be serious?