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Sounds like Amazon. Back in the day they managed to avoid 'layoffs' by transferring thousands of people from Fire Phone -> Alexa. They somehow avoided layoffs

Sounds like Amazon. Back in the day they managed to avoid 'layoffs' by transferring thousands of people from Fire Phone -> Alexa. They somehow avoided layoffs from shutting down Prime Air (drones, not 767s), even though that had a lot of employees. They're pretty good at getting people to leave without doing 'layoffs'. Heck, if you believe that they've always had 5-10% 'unregretted attrition' targets, which I do, and apply it to the whole company, that's 50-100k employees per year!

jasonpeacock 4y ago
Prime Air was not shut down: https://www.amazon.jobs/en/team/prime-air https://www.amazon.jobs/en/team/prime-air
- jjallen 4y ago
  There are zero openings. How does this prove it’s not shutdown?
  - AlotOfReading 4y ago
    They also had 30% turnover in 2021 and 20% the year before according to [1]. I can't imagine how miserable it must be there to generate those numbers. [1] https://web.archive.org/web/20220506053517/https://www.businessinsider.com/amazon-prime-air-attrition-drone-delivery-employee-turnover-2021-2022-5 https://web.archive.org/web/20220506053517/https://www.busin...
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
  - filoleg 4y ago
    > There are zero openings. How does this prove it’s not shutdown? Since when does having zero openings mean that a team is shut down? Sometimes teams are staffed enough to not need more people at the moment, so they will post a job opening whenever there is a need for it. A specific personal example: my org had a period of a couple of months with no openings in late second half of last year, simply because we didn't need more people at the time, and then we posted more openings later. We were nowhere close to being shut down.
    - pessimizer 4y ago
      > Since when does having zero openings mean that a team is shut down? This is not a claim that anyone made. The claim was that an ad for zero openings doesn't prove a team hasn't shut down.
      - filoleg 4y ago
        > an ad for zero openings doesn't prove a team hasn't shut down. If that's what the argument actually was trying to say, then I fully agree with it, makes perfect sense.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
- m00x 4y ago
  > There are currently no open jobs in Prime Air.
mjr00 4y ago
> Heck, if you believe that they've always had 5-10% 'unregretted attrition' targets, which I do, and apply it to the whole company, that's 50-100k employees per year! This came up last time the Amazon layoffs were on HN, but: the URA target (which was 2-6% when I was there) is for people, not positions. That is, the intent is that departments are continually removing their worst performers, but replacing those people as soon as possible. This is an elimination of 17,000 positions who will not be backfilled. Whether you agree with the URA target approach or not (I suspect most do not), 6% URA is fundamentally different from 6% layoffs.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
bencpeters 4y ago
Prime Air is not shut down, we're working on it and expanding. Can't post too many details, but we are actively delivering to customers in test markets today. A publically released video from a few months ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bDyeUiWL3M&ab_channel=amazon https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bDyeUiWL3M&ab_channel=amazo... Source: I'm an SDE at Prime Air.
- 8note 4y ago
  https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/12/amazon-begins-drone-deliveries-in-california-and-texas/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/12/amazon-begins-drone-... I saw this recently? => I work at Amazon but far away from prime air
- carabiner 4y ago
  Do you have a feel for if they might start hiring SDE's again before the end of the month? I was looking into them because it's right up my alley: I'm an aerospace engineer (aeronautics, flight test) turned software engineer who's worked a lot in rotorcraft.
  - bencpeters 4y ago
    I don't, unfortunately, that's above my paygrade ;-). It's likely going to be a function of the larger hiring situation at Amazon (we're currently in a corporate hiring freeze), rather than something Prime Air specific. Sounds like you've got a perfect background for Prime Air though! Hopefully we'll be hiring again sometime this year - feel free to reach out (email in profile) if you want to chat more about it.
    - carabiner 4y ago
      Thanks man, will reach out. Good luck on the program.
- CoastalCoder 4y ago
  [flagged]
quanticle 4y ago
Why do you believe Prime Air is shut down, when it just started making actual drone deliveries to customers in College Station TX, and Lockeford, CA [1]? [1]: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/12/amazon-begins-drone-deliveries-in-california-and-texas/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/12/amazon-begins-drone-...
- fijiaarone 4y ago
  Wouldn’t it be easier to just equip Miller Light with wings?

jasonpeacock 4y ago

Prime Air was not shut down: https://www.amazon.jobs/en/team/prime-air https://www.amazon.jobs/en/team/prime-air

jjallen 4y ago
There are zero openings. How does this prove it’s not shutdown?
- AlotOfReading 4y ago
  They also had 30% turnover in 2021 and 20% the year before according to [1]. I can't imagine how miserable it must be there to generate those numbers. [1] https://web.archive.org/web/20220506053517/https://www.businessinsider.com/amazon-prime-air-attrition-drone-delivery-employee-turnover-2021-2022-5 https://web.archive.org/web/20220506053517/https://www.busin...
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
- filoleg 4y ago
  > There are zero openings. How does this prove it’s not shutdown? Since when does having zero openings mean that a team is shut down? Sometimes teams are staffed enough to not need more people at the moment, so they will post a job opening whenever there is a need for it. A specific personal example: my org had a period of a couple of months with no openings in late second half of last year, simply because we didn't need more people at the time, and then we posted more openings later. We were nowhere close to being shut down.
  - pessimizer 4y ago
    > Since when does having zero openings mean that a team is shut down? This is not a claim that anyone made. The claim was that an ad for zero openings doesn't prove a team hasn't shut down.
    - filoleg 4y ago
      > an ad for zero openings doesn't prove a team hasn't shut down. If that's what the argument actually was trying to say, then I fully agree with it, makes perfect sense.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
m00x 4y ago
> There are currently no open jobs in Prime Air.

mjr00 4y ago

> Heck, if you believe that they've always had 5-10% 'unregretted attrition' targets, which I do, and apply it to the whole company, that's 50-100k employees per year! This came up last time the Amazon layoffs were on HN, but: the URA target (which was 2-6% when I was there) is for people, not positions. That is, the intent is that departments are continually removing their worst performers, but replacing those people as soon as possible. This is an elimination of 17,000 positions who will not be backfilled. Whether you agree with the URA target approach or not (I suspect most do not), 6% URA is fundamentally different from 6% layoffs.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

bencpeters 4y ago

Prime Air is not shut down, we're working on it and expanding. Can't post too many details, but we are actively delivering to customers in test markets today. A publically released video from a few months ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bDyeUiWL3M&ab_channel=amazon https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bDyeUiWL3M&ab_channel=amazo... Source: I'm an SDE at Prime Air.

8note 4y ago
https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/12/amazon-begins-drone-deliveries-in-california-and-texas/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/12/amazon-begins-drone-... I saw this recently? => I work at Amazon but far away from prime air
carabiner 4y ago
Do you have a feel for if they might start hiring SDE's again before the end of the month? I was looking into them because it's right up my alley: I'm an aerospace engineer (aeronautics, flight test) turned software engineer who's worked a lot in rotorcraft.
- bencpeters 4y ago
  I don't, unfortunately, that's above my paygrade ;-). It's likely going to be a function of the larger hiring situation at Amazon (we're currently in a corporate hiring freeze), rather than something Prime Air specific. Sounds like you've got a perfect background for Prime Air though! Hopefully we'll be hiring again sometime this year - feel free to reach out (email in profile) if you want to chat more about it.
  - carabiner 4y ago
    Thanks man, will reach out. Good luck on the program.
CoastalCoder 4y ago
[flagged]

quanticle 4y ago

Why do you believe Prime Air is shut down, when it just started making actual drone deliveries to customers in College Station TX, and Lockeford, CA [1]? [1]: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/12/amazon-begins-drone-deliveries-in-california-and-texas/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/12/amazon-begins-drone-...

fijiaarone 4y ago
Wouldn’t it be easier to just equip Miller Light with wings?