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> JS is the first language to really solve the distribution problem Excuse me, what? I just spilled my coffee all over the desk. Care to explain what you mean

> JS is the first language to really solve the distribution problem Excuse me, what? I just spilled my coffee all over the desk. Care to explain what you mean with the problem and how js "solved" it? In my view dependencies and distribution are terrible in javascript, but maybe we mean different things.

javajosh 4y ago
JavaScript is the only language in which you can write a program and distribute to every device in the world, today, cheaply and reliably. (technically this is an exaggeration - not everything has a browser. but you get the point.)
- yakshaving_jgt 4y ago
  You don't need to write it though. The average Internet building person would be better off writing in a language which isn't terrible, and only using JS as the bytecode of the web.
  - javajosh 4y ago
    Maybe. I think of it as an experiment. You may be right. It may also be that the potential of raw javascript hasn't been fully explored. That's my hypothesis. I don't think jquery was the best it could do. Time will tell who is right!
    - yakshaving_jgt 4y ago
      JavaScript won’t go through any revolutionary fundamental change because such a change would break the entire internet.
    - JeremyBanks 4y ago
      [dead]
  - jakelazaroff 4y ago
    Believe it or not, some of us have written other "not terrible" languages and actually prefer JavaScript.
    - yakshaving_jgt 4y ago
      I don’t believe it. I refuse to believe that someone can become proficient in a technology which forbids runtime errors and doesn’t bitrot, and then think “you know what, I wish my programs would error more at runtime and also refuse to compile because dependencies changed.” To want more failure is to be insane. I think rather a lot of programmers think they’ve tried alternatives, but in reality have experimented with syntax swaps of what is essentially the same language.
      - jakelazaroff 4y ago
        What language are you referring to? It sounds like you have something very specific in mind, because the usual “not terrible” suspects (Python, Ruby, Rust, Go, etc) don’t have the properties you’re talking about.
        yakshaving_jgt 4y ago
        Ruby and Python are essentially syntax swaps of the same language. Also not sure how practical it is to write in any of Ruby, Python, Go, or Rust and generate JavaScript. Elm would be an example of a language which is fundamentally better than JavaScript (and is a practical substitute for what most people are writing JavaScript for), but it isn't the only one.
        hombre_fatal 4y ago
        I’ve been using Elm for over five years on personal projects, but it isn’t a replacement for Javascript as a language, just some client side projects and ones where its async ffi is sufficient. I think you are falling into a trap of thinking there is a “best” in engineering when that’s basically never the case. Ask experienced developers why they prefer Javascript if you want to get a more nuanced view. I almost always reach for Javascript first, especially for server applications.

javajosh 4y ago

JavaScript is the only language in which you can write a program and distribute to every device in the world, today, cheaply and reliably. (technically this is an exaggeration - not everything has a browser. but you get the point.)

yakshaving_jgt 4y ago
You don't need to write it though. The average Internet building person would be better off writing in a language which isn't terrible, and only using JS as the bytecode of the web.
- javajosh 4y ago
  Maybe. I think of it as an experiment. You may be right. It may also be that the potential of raw javascript hasn't been fully explored. That's my hypothesis. I don't think jquery was the best it could do. Time will tell who is right!
  - yakshaving_jgt 4y ago
    JavaScript won’t go through any revolutionary fundamental change because such a change would break the entire internet.
  - JeremyBanks 4y ago
    [dead]
- jakelazaroff 4y ago
  Believe it or not, some of us have written other "not terrible" languages and actually prefer JavaScript.
  - yakshaving_jgt 4y ago
    I don’t believe it. I refuse to believe that someone can become proficient in a technology which forbids runtime errors and doesn’t bitrot, and then think “you know what, I wish my programs would error more at runtime and also refuse to compile because dependencies changed.” To want more failure is to be insane. I think rather a lot of programmers think they’ve tried alternatives, but in reality have experimented with syntax swaps of what is essentially the same language.
    - jakelazaroff 4y ago
      What language are you referring to? It sounds like you have something very specific in mind, because the usual “not terrible” suspects (Python, Ruby, Rust, Go, etc) don’t have the properties you’re talking about.
      - yakshaving_jgt 4y ago
        Ruby and Python are essentially syntax swaps of the same language. Also not sure how practical it is to write in any of Ruby, Python, Go, or Rust and generate JavaScript. Elm would be an example of a language which is fundamentally better than JavaScript (and is a practical substitute for what most people are writing JavaScript for), but it isn't the only one.
        hombre_fatal 4y ago
        I’ve been using Elm for over five years on personal projects, but it isn’t a replacement for Javascript as a language, just some client side projects and ones where its async ffi is sufficient. I think you are falling into a trap of thinking there is a “best” in engineering when that’s basically never the case. Ask experienced developers why they prefer Javascript if you want to get a more nuanced view. I almost always reach for Javascript first, especially for server applications.