4 ms·

Isn't all food addictive? Is there something more specific you mean about addition when it comes to these foods? It seems like it may be more about caloric de

Isn't all food addictive? Is there something more specific you mean about addition when it comes to these foods? It seems like it may be more about caloric density than addiction.

maxlamb 4y ago
You find broccoli addictive?
- tptacek 4y ago
  Hell yes. Have you ever roasted it with some lemon slices? Or broken up all the individual florets with a mandolin and tossed it as a salad? Whirred it into a soup? Broccoli is incredible.
- mjmahone17 4y ago
  Not OP but I do. If I had a plate of steamed or roasted broccoli available on demand at any time, I would eat it like most people do chips. Broccoli tastes great, but requires a lot more prep than “junk food” to get there. I eat junk food mainly because it takes me no effort and still tastes good: for me the addiction is not having to put in any effort to be satiated, more than the taste itself.
  - kenjackson 4y ago
    I'm OP, and I agree wholeheartedly with you. And when I do eat junk food I don't eat a crazy amount in volume. But the calorie density of them makes it such that I ate a crazy amount of calories. It's not that I eat a bag of chips per day. But a small bag of chips is 240 calories, while carrot chips of the same mass/volume are 20 calories. Do I prefer junk food over some healthy food -- yes, probably so (but I love broccoli). But I don't know that my eating habits are drastically different between the two. To put it another way, if the junk food I ate suddenly became healthy for you, I think people say I was just eating a healthy diet.
    - CadmiumYellow 4y ago
      I am the opposite - my eating habits are drastically different between the two. I find it very easy to eat reasonable amounts of healthy, whole foods and stop eating when I'm full. I find it virtually impossible to self-regulate my consumption of junk food. I will eat it when I'm not hungry, I crave it at odd times, I start eating it and I can't stop. I used to crave specific junk foods to the point that it was all I could think about and I'd leave my house in the middle of the night to walk 20 blocks through NYC to the one bodega that I knew would be open and would have the thing I was craving. On more than one occasion I have thrown a half-full bag of chips in the trash and then fished it out a couple hours later to finish it. It's disgusting. I may have an unusually addictive personality given that I've had issues with abusing other substances, but I noticed these addictive food behaviors in myself from a very young age before I'd ever touched alcohol or drugs. They bear little resemblance to how I eat when presented with fresh foods. We probably all have varying degrees of susceptibility to addictive junk foods and I'm just more susceptible than you (though also lucky enough to be very energetic and active so I haven't actually ended up overweight).
      - kenjackson 4y ago
        I guess we all have our differences. Part of the reason why I do eat junk food is largely the opposite reason compared to you. I'm too lazy to go get something I want to eat, so I'll just eat what is easiest to consume right now -- and it'll be something sitting in a bag in the pantry, rather than something I have to chop up or cook. But if I could afford a chef, ohh... I'd do that in a minute!
        CadmiumYellow 4y ago
        I only let myself eat junk food in a situation where I'm comfortable going way overboard because it's somehow self-limiting without requiring much willpower on my part. I can't keep it in my house for regular consumption because the convenience isn't worth the downsides of overeating and making myself feel like crap. I do keep easy snacks on hand - things like blocks of cheese and olives and deli meat and fruit. Even homemade popcorn with real melted butter is fine. I find all of those things difficult to overeat, unlike chips or cheetos or ramen noodles. I, too, wish I could afford a chef though!
drdeca 4y ago
In what sense is "all food addictive"? If you just mean "if you don't eat, you die", I don't think that qualifies as an addiction. If you mean "if you suddenly eat a lot more for some meal than you usually do, you will likely be more hungry the next day than usual", I also don't think that really qualifies. It's not the same kind of thing?
- kenjackson 4y ago
  It's not just "if you don't eat, you die". It's that you have a strong yearning to eat. Now that's probably an evolutionary adaptation to "if you don't eat, you die", but nevertheless I want to eat pretty consistently every day. Again, how is that different than a nicotine addiction? The only difference is that if I don't smoke, I won't die...
  - drdeca 4y ago
    Because the yearning for the nicotine is a result of things being out of whack due to the previous use of nicotine. That’s what an addiction is. With food, the desire to eat is part of the proper functioning, not due to damage due to previous food usage.
    - wetpaws 4y ago
      It triggers the same reward centers everything else does.
      - drdeca 4y ago
        I don’t think “triggering reward centers” is the reason that e.g. nicotine is addictive. It is because of chemical dependency.
        wetpaws 4y ago
        The chemical dependency will be triggered by everything because that's how brain works. It is made out of chemical stuff.
mensetmanusman 4y ago
No, try the potato only diet and see what happens.
wolverine876 4y ago
These foods are specifically addictive. I mean, water is addictive - I need it every three days, but that's not meaningful.
- kenjackson 4y ago
  What does "specifically addictive" mean though? People keep saying it, but give no definition for it. And you needing water every three days is meaningful. In fact, that's a great definition! Its clear what the meaning in the case of water is. I'm not sure what saying "Doritos" is addictive means? I love Doritos, but when I traveled abroad I went six months without seeing a bag and never thought of them. What exactly does "specifically addictive" mean?
  - CadmiumYellow 4y ago
    Once you start eating them it's difficult to stop because they override normal satiety mechanisms. Foods like Doritos are quite literally engineered for maximum pleasure (dopamine) and minimum satiety. I'm sober now and I've noticed that it's incredibly hard for me to drink more than one or two glasses of juice but incredibly easy for me to drink alcohol indefinitely - it feels similar to the difference between eating Doritos and eating nuts or cheese, where one promotes satiety while the other actively drives overconsumption. Relevant article: https://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/24/magazine/the-extraordinary-science-of-junk-food.html https://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/24/magazine/the-extraordinar...
    - kenjackson 4y ago
      > Once you start eating them it's difficult to stop because they override normal satiety mechanisms But it's not difficult to stop. From a volume/mass perspective I eat fairly small amount of Doritos in sittings compared to most "healthy" food. Its just that Doritos are super calorie dense. I definitely eat a higher mass of eggplant in a sitting than Doritos. And when I don't have access to Doritos, I don't ever think of doing anything unethical or illegal to obtain access.

Isn't all food addictive? Is there something more specific you mean about addition when it comes to these foods? It seems like it may be more about caloric density than addiction.

maxlamb 4y ago

You find broccoli addictive?

tptacek 4y ago
Hell yes. Have you ever roasted it with some lemon slices? Or broken up all the individual florets with a mandolin and tossed it as a salad? Whirred it into a soup? Broccoli is incredible.
mjmahone17 4y ago
Not OP but I do. If I had a plate of steamed or roasted broccoli available on demand at any time, I would eat it like most people do chips. Broccoli tastes great, but requires a lot more prep than “junk food” to get there. I eat junk food mainly because it takes me no effort and still tastes good: for me the addiction is not having to put in any effort to be satiated, more than the taste itself.
- kenjackson 4y ago
  I'm OP, and I agree wholeheartedly with you. And when I do eat junk food I don't eat a crazy amount in volume. But the calorie density of them makes it such that I ate a crazy amount of calories. It's not that I eat a bag of chips per day. But a small bag of chips is 240 calories, while carrot chips of the same mass/volume are 20 calories. Do I prefer junk food over some healthy food -- yes, probably so (but I love broccoli). But I don't know that my eating habits are drastically different between the two. To put it another way, if the junk food I ate suddenly became healthy for you, I think people say I was just eating a healthy diet.
  - CadmiumYellow 4y ago
    I am the opposite - my eating habits are drastically different between the two. I find it very easy to eat reasonable amounts of healthy, whole foods and stop eating when I'm full. I find it virtually impossible to self-regulate my consumption of junk food. I will eat it when I'm not hungry, I crave it at odd times, I start eating it and I can't stop. I used to crave specific junk foods to the point that it was all I could think about and I'd leave my house in the middle of the night to walk 20 blocks through NYC to the one bodega that I knew would be open and would have the thing I was craving. On more than one occasion I have thrown a half-full bag of chips in the trash and then fished it out a couple hours later to finish it. It's disgusting. I may have an unusually addictive personality given that I've had issues with abusing other substances, but I noticed these addictive food behaviors in myself from a very young age before I'd ever touched alcohol or drugs. They bear little resemblance to how I eat when presented with fresh foods. We probably all have varying degrees of susceptibility to addictive junk foods and I'm just more susceptible than you (though also lucky enough to be very energetic and active so I haven't actually ended up overweight).
    - kenjackson 4y ago
      I guess we all have our differences. Part of the reason why I do eat junk food is largely the opposite reason compared to you. I'm too lazy to go get something I want to eat, so I'll just eat what is easiest to consume right now -- and it'll be something sitting in a bag in the pantry, rather than something I have to chop up or cook. But if I could afford a chef, ohh... I'd do that in a minute!
      - CadmiumYellow 4y ago
        I only let myself eat junk food in a situation where I'm comfortable going way overboard because it's somehow self-limiting without requiring much willpower on my part. I can't keep it in my house for regular consumption because the convenience isn't worth the downsides of overeating and making myself feel like crap. I do keep easy snacks on hand - things like blocks of cheese and olives and deli meat and fruit. Even homemade popcorn with real melted butter is fine. I find all of those things difficult to overeat, unlike chips or cheetos or ramen noodles. I, too, wish I could afford a chef though!

drdeca 4y ago

In what sense is "all food addictive"? If you just mean "if you don't eat, you die", I don't think that qualifies as an addiction. If you mean "if you suddenly eat a lot more for some meal than you usually do, you will likely be more hungry the next day than usual", I also don't think that really qualifies. It's not the same kind of thing?

kenjackson 4y ago
It's not just "if you don't eat, you die". It's that you have a strong yearning to eat. Now that's probably an evolutionary adaptation to "if you don't eat, you die", but nevertheless I want to eat pretty consistently every day. Again, how is that different than a nicotine addiction? The only difference is that if I don't smoke, I won't die...
- drdeca 4y ago
  Because the yearning for the nicotine is a result of things being out of whack due to the previous use of nicotine. That’s what an addiction is. With food, the desire to eat is part of the proper functioning, not due to damage due to previous food usage.
  - wetpaws 4y ago
    It triggers the same reward centers everything else does.
    - drdeca 4y ago
      I don’t think “triggering reward centers” is the reason that e.g. nicotine is addictive. It is because of chemical dependency.
      - wetpaws 4y ago
        The chemical dependency will be triggered by everything because that's how brain works. It is made out of chemical stuff.

mensetmanusman 4y ago

No, try the potato only diet and see what happens.

wolverine876 4y ago

These foods are specifically addictive. I mean, water is addictive - I need it every three days, but that's not meaningful.

kenjackson 4y ago
What does "specifically addictive" mean though? People keep saying it, but give no definition for it. And you needing water every three days is meaningful. In fact, that's a great definition! Its clear what the meaning in the case of water is. I'm not sure what saying "Doritos" is addictive means? I love Doritos, but when I traveled abroad I went six months without seeing a bag and never thought of them. What exactly does "specifically addictive" mean?
- CadmiumYellow 4y ago
  Once you start eating them it's difficult to stop because they override normal satiety mechanisms. Foods like Doritos are quite literally engineered for maximum pleasure (dopamine) and minimum satiety. I'm sober now and I've noticed that it's incredibly hard for me to drink more than one or two glasses of juice but incredibly easy for me to drink alcohol indefinitely - it feels similar to the difference between eating Doritos and eating nuts or cheese, where one promotes satiety while the other actively drives overconsumption. Relevant article: https://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/24/magazine/the-extraordinary-science-of-junk-food.html https://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/24/magazine/the-extraordinar...
  - kenjackson 4y ago
    > Once you start eating them it's difficult to stop because they override normal satiety mechanisms But it's not difficult to stop. From a volume/mass perspective I eat fairly small amount of Doritos in sittings compared to most "healthy" food. Its just that Doritos are super calorie dense. I definitely eat a higher mass of eggplant in a sitting than Doritos. And when I don't have access to Doritos, I don't ever think of doing anything unethical or illegal to obtain access.