4 ms·

You're forgetting that increases in productivity used to be partially shared with the middle class who enjoyed a rising standard of life as a result. Around th

You're forgetting that increases in productivity used to be partially shared with the middle class who enjoyed a rising standard of life as a result. Around that time it changed with the rich keeping all those profits to themselves. If middle class salaries had kept up, houses and education would be affordable.

Manuel_D 4y ago
Higher salaries don't solve shortages. If there's 200 buyers for 150 homes, higher salaries would just let those buyer make larger bids. In order to let the poorest 50 people get homes, we need 50 more homes.
- int_19h 4y ago
  There are dozens of vacant homes in US for each homeless person. The national vacancy rate is something like 10%.
  - Manuel_D 4y ago
    In the US as a whole, sure. But the housing affordability issues aren't across the whole US: it's in specific metros. Houses in Nebraska don't solve the affordability crisis in San Francisco. Furthermore, people aren't exactly keen on letting homeless people live in their property for free. Hotels in my city experimented with this: they got small checks for housing homeless people during COVID, when lockdown massacred the hospitality market. It was a complete disaster: the rooms were trashed and they lost more money than they received from the government.
    - tchaffee 4y ago
      Housing affordability issues are indeed across the whole US if you include local wage rates in the equation. The middle class simply can no longer afford the same housing as they could on a single earner wage as they could when tax rates on the rich were 70%. A lot of the problem is hedge funds grabbing up huge numbers of houses across the country and then jacking up the rents using collusion through software. At a 70٪ tax rate that money to grab up so many properties wouldn't even be there. https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2022/10/company-that-makes-rent-setting-software-for-landlords-sued-for-collusion/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2022/10/company-that-mak...
- tchaffee 4y ago
  Good thing there isn't a housing shortage. And most countries easily manage to pay for education and healthcare.
  - Manuel_D 4y ago
    There is indeed a housing shortage, or more specifically shortages in desirable metros. American cities are refusing to build denser residencies, driving up the cost of housing. Most countries aren't America. Germany, as a point of comparison, had half the share of it's population enrolled in university. Part of this is because of age distribution: America is younger and has more college age people. Also, about 50% of German high schoolers go on to university as compared to 70% of Americans. People keep pointing to the European education system, but my retort is that following Europe's example would entail reducing enrollment considerably. Healthcare is indeed one place where administrative changes could solve things. Most European countries, along with Japan and South Korea, work by giving citizens a stipend to spend on a healthcare plan from a marketplace of providers (either directly, or indirectly through subsidizing plans). This is largely what Romney was proposing in 2012, but that effort fizzled out. Unfortunately, the one party in America in favor of healthcare reform seems to be laser focused on a fully nationalized healthcare to the exclusion of anything else.
    - tchaffee 4y ago
      A "housing shortage in desirable metros" is moving the goal posts. The claim was that unaffordable housing can only be attributed to a shortage and has nothing to do with massively increased wealth gaps nor the shrinking middle class. "Most countries aren't America" is just an excuse. Most European countries aren't Germany. So by that reasoning most European countries can't afford education or healthcare. Here's what really makes the US different: most countries don't have America's massive wealth gaps. That's the real cause.
      - Manuel_D 4y ago
        Most European countries do share similar demographic trends relative to the US as Germany. In fact Germany's enrollment rates are above average. Again, wealth gaps don't affect the prices of goods. The cost of cars, cell phones, and plenty of other things are largely the same between the US and other developed countries. Housing in the US is plenty cheap outside desirable metros. And Europe similarly has expensive housing in desirable metros. Housing is expensive in Stockholm, the better parts of London, etc.

Manuel_D 4y ago

Higher salaries don't solve shortages. If there's 200 buyers for 150 homes, higher salaries would just let those buyer make larger bids. In order to let the poorest 50 people get homes, we need 50 more homes.

int_19h 4y ago
There are dozens of vacant homes in US for each homeless person. The national vacancy rate is something like 10%.
- Manuel_D 4y ago
  In the US as a whole, sure. But the housing affordability issues aren't across the whole US: it's in specific metros. Houses in Nebraska don't solve the affordability crisis in San Francisco. Furthermore, people aren't exactly keen on letting homeless people live in their property for free. Hotels in my city experimented with this: they got small checks for housing homeless people during COVID, when lockdown massacred the hospitality market. It was a complete disaster: the rooms were trashed and they lost more money than they received from the government.
  - tchaffee 4y ago
    Housing affordability issues are indeed across the whole US if you include local wage rates in the equation. The middle class simply can no longer afford the same housing as they could on a single earner wage as they could when tax rates on the rich were 70%. A lot of the problem is hedge funds grabbing up huge numbers of houses across the country and then jacking up the rents using collusion through software. At a 70٪ tax rate that money to grab up so many properties wouldn't even be there. https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2022/10/company-that-makes-rent-setting-software-for-landlords-sued-for-collusion/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2022/10/company-that-mak...
tchaffee 4y ago
Good thing there isn't a housing shortage. And most countries easily manage to pay for education and healthcare.
- Manuel_D 4y ago
  There is indeed a housing shortage, or more specifically shortages in desirable metros. American cities are refusing to build denser residencies, driving up the cost of housing. Most countries aren't America. Germany, as a point of comparison, had half the share of it's population enrolled in university. Part of this is because of age distribution: America is younger and has more college age people. Also, about 50% of German high schoolers go on to university as compared to 70% of Americans. People keep pointing to the European education system, but my retort is that following Europe's example would entail reducing enrollment considerably. Healthcare is indeed one place where administrative changes could solve things. Most European countries, along with Japan and South Korea, work by giving citizens a stipend to spend on a healthcare plan from a marketplace of providers (either directly, or indirectly through subsidizing plans). This is largely what Romney was proposing in 2012, but that effort fizzled out. Unfortunately, the one party in America in favor of healthcare reform seems to be laser focused on a fully nationalized healthcare to the exclusion of anything else.
  - tchaffee 4y ago
    A "housing shortage in desirable metros" is moving the goal posts. The claim was that unaffordable housing can only be attributed to a shortage and has nothing to do with massively increased wealth gaps nor the shrinking middle class. "Most countries aren't America" is just an excuse. Most European countries aren't Germany. So by that reasoning most European countries can't afford education or healthcare. Here's what really makes the US different: most countries don't have America's massive wealth gaps. That's the real cause.
    - Manuel_D 4y ago
      Most European countries do share similar demographic trends relative to the US as Germany. In fact Germany's enrollment rates are above average. Again, wealth gaps don't affect the prices of goods. The cost of cars, cell phones, and plenty of other things are largely the same between the US and other developed countries. Housing in the US is plenty cheap outside desirable metros. And Europe similarly has expensive housing in desirable metros. Housing is expensive in Stockholm, the better parts of London, etc.