4 ms·

Bullying implies a power imbalance. This is google we are talking about. They did poach a huge chunk of the safari team. They then did launch a competing brows

Bullying implies a power imbalance. This is google we are talking about. They did poach a huge chunk of the safari team. They then did launch a competing browser and aggressively pushed that browser globally. They forked the mainline project of WebKit and created blink - for reasons relating to Chrome product roadmap. It was a big deal when they did it. But Jobs predicting this is what they were up to and calling google and complaining they are poaching a whole team from Apple. Is bullying? Which CEO wouldn’t be upset at an entire core team being targeted by a competitor? It’s not price fixing, it’s not illegal (to be upset or to call another ceo and complain).

shkkmo 4y ago
> But Jobs predicting this is what they were up to and calling google and complaining they are poaching a whole team from Apple. Is bullying? How would you feel if you were actively looking for another job and the CEO of your company repeatedly called one the the companies that was going to give you an offer to yell at them and try to intimidate them with threats of "war" into not hiring you? That sure sounds a lot like bullying, even if you don't think it is bullying, it is certainly an illegal business practice. This isn't just my opinion, but that of the DOJ and the court. While that case was settled without a trial, I'll note that the judge took the rare step of rejecting the first settlement agreement because Apple and Google didn't pay enough.
- onethought 4y ago
  Want that for non complete agreements? Not for CEOs shouting at each other. This want “an individual looking for a job”. This was a google going after an entire team. Honestly everyone has the bullying round the wrong way here. Steve jobs was an ass in this instance, but his actions are likely 99.9% of other CEOs actions
  - shkkmo 4y ago
    > Want that for non complete agreements? Some places have made those illegal or greatly restricted them, hopefully that will spread. > This want “an individual looking for a job”. This was a google going after an entire team. It was google trying to hire ~3 internal recommendations. From the emails it sounds like for the main hiring prospect was potentially more interested if all 3 got offers and was also already looking at offer from other companies. I don't specifically see anything about it being an "entire team", so I'm curious where you got that from. > Steve jobs was an ass in this instance, but his actions are likely 99.9% of other CEOs actions I think the 99.9% number is a bit too high (and certainly hard to source). I do think you are correct that this (and other) illegal business practices are extremely common among CEOs, especially in companies of this size. Though I think CEOs of companies of this size are usually quite a bit more circumspect in how they go about it. Again, the legal way to approach this is to make the developers an offer of better projects (which is sounds like Apple tried), money or other perks to make the job attractive. A volatile CEO who did what Jobs did here would probably count against that (if the employees knew what he did.)

shkkmo 4y ago

> But Jobs predicting this is what they were up to and calling google and complaining they are poaching a whole team from Apple. Is bullying? How would you feel if you were actively looking for another job and the CEO of your company repeatedly called one the the companies that was going to give you an offer to yell at them and try to intimidate them with threats of "war" into not hiring you? That sure sounds a lot like bullying, even if you don't think it is bullying, it is certainly an illegal business practice. This isn't just my opinion, but that of the DOJ and the court. While that case was settled without a trial, I'll note that the judge took the rare step of rejecting the first settlement agreement because Apple and Google didn't pay enough.

onethought 4y ago
Want that for non complete agreements? Not for CEOs shouting at each other. This want “an individual looking for a job”. This was a google going after an entire team. Honestly everyone has the bullying round the wrong way here. Steve jobs was an ass in this instance, but his actions are likely 99.9% of other CEOs actions
- shkkmo 4y ago
  > Want that for non complete agreements? Some places have made those illegal or greatly restricted them, hopefully that will spread. > This want “an individual looking for a job”. This was a google going after an entire team. It was google trying to hire ~3 internal recommendations. From the emails it sounds like for the main hiring prospect was potentially more interested if all 3 got offers and was also already looking at offer from other companies. I don't specifically see anything about it being an "entire team", so I'm curious where you got that from. > Steve jobs was an ass in this instance, but his actions are likely 99.9% of other CEOs actions I think the 99.9% number is a bit too high (and certainly hard to source). I do think you are correct that this (and other) illegal business practices are extremely common among CEOs, especially in companies of this size. Though I think CEOs of companies of this size are usually quite a bit more circumspect in how they go about it. Again, the legal way to approach this is to make the developers an offer of better projects (which is sounds like Apple tried), money or other perks to make the job attractive. A volatile CEO who did what Jobs did here would probably count against that (if the employees knew what he did.)