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> How many? Nobody I know has done this with an actual spreadsheet of cost per child. Everyone I know has done this with a spreadsheet of cost per child. Arou

> How many? Nobody I know has done this with an actual spreadsheet of cost per child. Everyone I know has done this with a spreadsheet of cost per child. Around abouts where I live, the cost is 40k+ per year per child, not counting the obscene amount of $ you need to spend for a house that has room for more than 1 child, that is going to cost you well over a million, and if you want it in an area with good schools, you are looking at nearly 2 million. So yeah, people here do the calculation, because not everyone can afford to dump 2 million on a house so they can have a second child.

kjkjadksj 4y ago
The calculations seem pretty subjective on whats actually essential if a kid actually costs you 40k a year. I don’t even spend that much on myself .
- Konnstann 4y ago
  Presumably you aren't constantly growing and in constant need of new clothes, nor do you need to pay someone to look after you on a day to day basis a la childcare.
  - jefftk 4y ago
    These are on vastly different scales: we probably pay 50x more for childcare than clothes.
- michaelt 4y ago
  Right, but you probably don't need childcare. Have a kid in California and you can look forward to paying $17000/year for infant care [1]. With California's median per-capita income of $41000/year [2] having two kids is an expensive business! [1] https://tootris.com/edu/blog/parents/cost-of-child-care-in-california-by-city-age-and-type-of-care-provider/ https://tootris.com/edu/blog/parents/cost-of-child-care-in-c... [2] https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/CA/INC110221 https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/CA/INC110221
  - com2kid 4y ago
    Seattle is 24000-30k a year for infant care. 17,000 would be very, very, cheap.
helloworld11 4y ago
These calculations are absurdly subjective and based on some sort of very unusually defined notion of costs per child. In the country I live in (and in many others i'm sure) millions of people manage to raise perfectly healthy kids wonderfully without earning or spending anywhere near those amounts per child or for a home. 2 million for a home fit for two kids? Ridiculous.
- com2kid 4y ago
  I'm in Seattle. Child care is 24k-30k a year, with wait lists that can exceed a year. Parents don't have a choice, if they are lucky enough to get a daycare spot they have to take it wherever it is at. Gas in Seattle is still around $4.60 a gallon, nearly $1 more per gallon than outside the city. > 2 million for a home fit for two kids? A 70yr old home in an above average neighborhood, with 3 bedrooms, costs 1.2 million. If you want that house in an area with highly ranked public schools, you will be approaching 2 million. If you want 4 bedrooms (home office if your company does wfh), add another 200-300k. For the areas with the best public schools, you'll need to go to a neighboring city and those houses can easily reach 2 million, home prices near the nicest schools have nearly doubled in the last 3 years. A note about schools here, the school you go to is based on where you live, and schools are funded with property taxes. This means more expensive neighborhoods have better schools. In some schools the pipes still have lead in them and the water is unsafe to drink. The city does not have enough money to fund the schools and as such even has repeatedly cut programs as schools are ran in a shoestring budget year after year. Because of this there is a lot of competition between parents to buy houses in nicer neighborhoods, which dramatically increases home prices.
  - helloworld11 4y ago
    Congratulations on having exceptionally high personal living standards while residing in the 7th most expensive U.S city. You represent a miniscule fraction of the world's population. Now of course, this doesn't mean you should base your standards on how hundreds of millions of other families with one or more children manage to live okay in the rest of the world, but I note that even in Seattle itself, there are 110,672 children under the age of 18 and I guarantee you that the parents of only a small fraction of these kids own a 2 million-dollar home or pay 30 grand per year in childcare expenses. Again, many, many people raise children quite well and responsibly without needing anywhere near $2 million to have a couple of them.
kortilla 4y ago
Nobody needs to dump 2 million on a house in the Bay Area to have kids. Whoever is running that calculation is deluding themselves and just wants to make absolutely no lifestyle sacrifice for another kid. Those numbers are the yuppie calculations that you get when neither adult wants to stop living in one of the most expensive parts of town and neither wants to be a stay at home parent even part time. The cost is not 40k per year per child. Re-run the numbers using public schools and having a stay at home parent with no more than a few hours a week of childcare.
- com2kid 4y ago
  > The cost is not 40k per year per child. Re-run the numbers using public schools and having a stay at home parent with no more than a few hours a week of childcare. Why stay at home parent, that is absurd now days. > and neither wants to be a stay at home parent even part time. People want a retirement plan, and that means working and contributing to a 401k. If my wife stopped working, well for one the childcare savings wouldn't be enough to make up for lost income, and two, our retirement plans would be shot to pieces. Fwiw I'm in Seattle, if you want to go to good public schools, houses cost a lot more. House price here is highly correlated with the quality of the local schools. Want to go to the best schools in the area? Looking at moving outside Seattle to Bellevue, and an old house in the area with the best public schools will reach almost 2 million. House prices around there have nearly doubled in the past 3 year. I'm only in an area with slightly above average schools, so a 4 bedroom house here is 1.2-1.5 million. Although since Seattle schools just cancelled their gifted program, parents with smart kids now have to pay for private schools, so shove those costs on top of whatever is saved by moving to Seattle proper instead of one of the more expensive suburbs. There are not fancy new houses, these are "whatever house is for sale that has the right number of bedrooms" and are often quite old.

kjkjadksj 4y ago

The calculations seem pretty subjective on whats actually essential if a kid actually costs you 40k a year. I don’t even spend that much on myself .

Konnstann 4y ago
Presumably you aren't constantly growing and in constant need of new clothes, nor do you need to pay someone to look after you on a day to day basis a la childcare.
- jefftk 4y ago
  These are on vastly different scales: we probably pay 50x more for childcare than clothes.
michaelt 4y ago
Right, but you probably don't need childcare. Have a kid in California and you can look forward to paying $17000/year for infant care [1]. With California's median per-capita income of $41000/year [2] having two kids is an expensive business! [1] https://tootris.com/edu/blog/parents/cost-of-child-care-in-california-by-city-age-and-type-of-care-provider/ https://tootris.com/edu/blog/parents/cost-of-child-care-in-c... [2] https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/CA/INC110221 https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/CA/INC110221
- com2kid 4y ago
  Seattle is 24000-30k a year for infant care. 17,000 would be very, very, cheap.

helloworld11 4y ago

These calculations are absurdly subjective and based on some sort of very unusually defined notion of costs per child. In the country I live in (and in many others i'm sure) millions of people manage to raise perfectly healthy kids wonderfully without earning or spending anywhere near those amounts per child or for a home. 2 million for a home fit for two kids? Ridiculous.

com2kid 4y ago
I'm in Seattle. Child care is 24k-30k a year, with wait lists that can exceed a year. Parents don't have a choice, if they are lucky enough to get a daycare spot they have to take it wherever it is at. Gas in Seattle is still around $4.60 a gallon, nearly $1 more per gallon than outside the city. > 2 million for a home fit for two kids? A 70yr old home in an above average neighborhood, with 3 bedrooms, costs 1.2 million. If you want that house in an area with highly ranked public schools, you will be approaching 2 million. If you want 4 bedrooms (home office if your company does wfh), add another 200-300k. For the areas with the best public schools, you'll need to go to a neighboring city and those houses can easily reach 2 million, home prices near the nicest schools have nearly doubled in the last 3 years. A note about schools here, the school you go to is based on where you live, and schools are funded with property taxes. This means more expensive neighborhoods have better schools. In some schools the pipes still have lead in them and the water is unsafe to drink. The city does not have enough money to fund the schools and as such even has repeatedly cut programs as schools are ran in a shoestring budget year after year. Because of this there is a lot of competition between parents to buy houses in nicer neighborhoods, which dramatically increases home prices.
- helloworld11 4y ago
  Congratulations on having exceptionally high personal living standards while residing in the 7th most expensive U.S city. You represent a miniscule fraction of the world's population. Now of course, this doesn't mean you should base your standards on how hundreds of millions of other families with one or more children manage to live okay in the rest of the world, but I note that even in Seattle itself, there are 110,672 children under the age of 18 and I guarantee you that the parents of only a small fraction of these kids own a 2 million-dollar home or pay 30 grand per year in childcare expenses. Again, many, many people raise children quite well and responsibly without needing anywhere near $2 million to have a couple of them.

kortilla 4y ago

Nobody needs to dump 2 million on a house in the Bay Area to have kids. Whoever is running that calculation is deluding themselves and just wants to make absolutely no lifestyle sacrifice for another kid. Those numbers are the yuppie calculations that you get when neither adult wants to stop living in one of the most expensive parts of town and neither wants to be a stay at home parent even part time. The cost is not 40k per year per child. Re-run the numbers using public schools and having a stay at home parent with no more than a few hours a week of childcare.

com2kid 4y ago
> The cost is not 40k per year per child. Re-run the numbers using public schools and having a stay at home parent with no more than a few hours a week of childcare. Why stay at home parent, that is absurd now days. > and neither wants to be a stay at home parent even part time. People want a retirement plan, and that means working and contributing to a 401k. If my wife stopped working, well for one the childcare savings wouldn't be enough to make up for lost income, and two, our retirement plans would be shot to pieces. Fwiw I'm in Seattle, if you want to go to good public schools, houses cost a lot more. House price here is highly correlated with the quality of the local schools. Want to go to the best schools in the area? Looking at moving outside Seattle to Bellevue, and an old house in the area with the best public schools will reach almost 2 million. House prices around there have nearly doubled in the past 3 year. I'm only in an area with slightly above average schools, so a 4 bedroom house here is 1.2-1.5 million. Although since Seattle schools just cancelled their gifted program, parents with smart kids now have to pay for private schools, so shove those costs on top of whatever is saved by moving to Seattle proper instead of one of the more expensive suburbs. There are not fancy new houses, these are "whatever house is for sale that has the right number of bedrooms" and are often quite old.