4 ms·

I find it telling that he is branded a troll or worse, yet the mirror image of his message, where women are propped up is spread far and wide. People should as

I find it telling that he is branded a troll or worse, yet the mirror image of his message, where women are propped up is spread far and wide. People should ask WHY he is so popular. People prefer to try to shut someone down and then are shocked, shocked I tell you when a huge number of people retaliate. See the Trump election as an example of demonizing a large percentage of people and trying to make it politically incorrect to defend anyone who isn’t a minority.

foreverCarlos 4y ago
He is popular because he is a populist like Trump. He offers simple solutions to complex problems. Solutions that don’t work but empower people unwilling or incapable of committing to more complex solutions.
NikolaNovak 4y ago
1. Mirror message of "propping women up" is empathically not "encouraging violence against women". 2. I think it's broadly understood why he and the like are popular. You artificially divide population into groups, then persuade one that the other group is somehow at fault for your ills. It's a phenomenally successful strategy - as much as it is abhorrent. It particularly prays on the various kinds of downtrodden, angry, frustrated, unlucky or poor,because it distracts with easy and oversimplified answers. The hard part is not understanding why it's successful. The hard part is learning how to save humanity by fighting it, because that movement / strategy only leads to distraction and ignorance. (This is not saying we shouldn't work hard to understand that strategy, on the contrary. I strongly feel you cannot fight something if you don't understand it.)
- NikolaNovak 4y ago
  P. S. Fwiw, I've oscillated significantly re trump election and voters over last 6 years and still do : On one hand, it is important to show empathy, engage in conversation, focus on common points, and truly try to understand someone's circumstances, thoughts, reasons, and goals. We are all humans and we have needs and there's probably more that we have alike. Isolation and shunning and snooty patronizing are not productive. There are reasons 46mil people voted and would still vote for him and those reasons, to your point, should not be ignored or dismissed. Everybody should be heard, thoughts should not be silenced. I believe in marketplace of ideas and don't like censorship so I agree that we are trying too hard to supress discussion with offense and Twitter outrage. On the other hand, at some point one has to hold adults accountable for their own opinions, decisions, actions and world frameworks; and someone voting for trump has framework completely different then mine and, I feel, completely counter productive and destructive (this is not a "conservative" framework. Trump is not a conservative. Trump is a narcissistic Bully which overrides any ideology). I recognize that 46 million of people felt exactly the same ("he is the devil") about Obama. However, one telling difference is that they have to make up increasingly incredulous stuff about Obama eating babies with his Jewish owners etc to support their opinion, whereas I need only point to Trumps actual documented and proudly owned words and actions to support my disagreement. Basically, 20 year old me wanted to change the world and engage with everybody and be profoundly philosophical. The 45 year old me with kids and job and mortgage has no patience to go through same tired self contradictory, self defeating internally inconsistent crap with people who think putting "fuck Biden" and "fuck Trudeau" signs on their car, house and faceboom are meaningful ways to engage in political discourse.
  - foreverCarlos 4y ago
    These "oscillations" are compatible in my view. Empathy does not equal enablement - a maxim that is at the core of a lot of confusion in the modern-day culture war. Hearing the opposing view, communicating in a kind and responsive way isn't supposed to lead to an implementation of false ideas. Trump is a sociopath who quite successfully exploited the anxieties of millions of people... but their grievances do matter - it's in all of our interest to lift everyone up, not dismiss or even humiliate half of the country. However, we should also recognize that Trump is not the way to accomplish that, he does not offer any solutions, he just mirrors and magnifies the worst parts of the human condition.
watwut 4y ago
He is popular, because the "you are superior would dominate and entitled to beat others into submission" is emotionally pleasant message to hear. He says what many young men want to believe and find pleasant to hear.

foreverCarlos 4y ago

He is popular because he is a populist like Trump. He offers simple solutions to complex problems. Solutions that don’t work but empower people unwilling or incapable of committing to more complex solutions.

NikolaNovak 4y ago

1. Mirror message of "propping women up" is empathically not "encouraging violence against women". 2. I think it's broadly understood why he and the like are popular. You artificially divide population into groups, then persuade one that the other group is somehow at fault for your ills. It's a phenomenally successful strategy - as much as it is abhorrent. It particularly prays on the various kinds of downtrodden, angry, frustrated, unlucky or poor,because it distracts with easy and oversimplified answers. The hard part is not understanding why it's successful. The hard part is learning how to save humanity by fighting it, because that movement / strategy only leads to distraction and ignorance. (This is not saying we shouldn't work hard to understand that strategy, on the contrary. I strongly feel you cannot fight something if you don't understand it.)

NikolaNovak 4y ago
P. S. Fwiw, I've oscillated significantly re trump election and voters over last 6 years and still do : On one hand, it is important to show empathy, engage in conversation, focus on common points, and truly try to understand someone's circumstances, thoughts, reasons, and goals. We are all humans and we have needs and there's probably more that we have alike. Isolation and shunning and snooty patronizing are not productive. There are reasons 46mil people voted and would still vote for him and those reasons, to your point, should not be ignored or dismissed. Everybody should be heard, thoughts should not be silenced. I believe in marketplace of ideas and don't like censorship so I agree that we are trying too hard to supress discussion with offense and Twitter outrage. On the other hand, at some point one has to hold adults accountable for their own opinions, decisions, actions and world frameworks; and someone voting for trump has framework completely different then mine and, I feel, completely counter productive and destructive (this is not a "conservative" framework. Trump is not a conservative. Trump is a narcissistic Bully which overrides any ideology). I recognize that 46 million of people felt exactly the same ("he is the devil") about Obama. However, one telling difference is that they have to make up increasingly incredulous stuff about Obama eating babies with his Jewish owners etc to support their opinion, whereas I need only point to Trumps actual documented and proudly owned words and actions to support my disagreement. Basically, 20 year old me wanted to change the world and engage with everybody and be profoundly philosophical. The 45 year old me with kids and job and mortgage has no patience to go through same tired self contradictory, self defeating internally inconsistent crap with people who think putting "fuck Biden" and "fuck Trudeau" signs on their car, house and faceboom are meaningful ways to engage in political discourse.
- foreverCarlos 4y ago
  These "oscillations" are compatible in my view. Empathy does not equal enablement - a maxim that is at the core of a lot of confusion in the modern-day culture war. Hearing the opposing view, communicating in a kind and responsive way isn't supposed to lead to an implementation of false ideas. Trump is a sociopath who quite successfully exploited the anxieties of millions of people... but their grievances do matter - it's in all of our interest to lift everyone up, not dismiss or even humiliate half of the country. However, we should also recognize that Trump is not the way to accomplish that, he does not offer any solutions, he just mirrors and magnifies the worst parts of the human condition.

watwut 4y ago

He is popular, because the "you are superior would dominate and entitled to beat others into submission" is emotionally pleasant message to hear. He says what many young men want to believe and find pleasant to hear.