4 ms·

It's crazy how out of control the FBI is. It's time for another Church commission, prosecutions of misconduct, and a RIF.

ctvo 4y ago
Please cite where the FBI failed to follow the law in this case. The FBI is a law enforcement agency. If you have an issue with the law, that's separate. In this case it appears the law is the issue: > For most of the country’s history, civil forfeiture was an obscure backwater. At the time of the Founding, civil forfeiture was limited to confiscating ships and cargo that ran afoul of customs duties. But now civil forfeiture has become wildly popular across law enforcement, precisely because it doesn’t require a criminal conviction, or even an indictment, to confiscate someone’s property. Empty talking points from conspiracy videos you saw on Youtube aren't helpful.
- voakbasda 4y ago
  Civil forfeiture is legalized theft. Rationalize its legality all you want, but it is the government agents acting like criminals. This kind of behavior flagrantly steals assets from lawful citizens. They are routinely overstepping the bounds of civil behavior, so these institutions need to be burned to the ground - literally if need be.
  - ctvo 4y ago
    > They are routinely overstepping the bounds of civil behavior, so these institutions need to be burned to the ground - literally if need be. Or you know, work on changing the civil forfeiture laws and save the libertarian revolt talk for another issue?
    - DaniloDias 4y ago
      [dead]
    - voakbasda 4y ago
      Because I do not believe for one second that such a policy can be reformed? That our system has reached a stable state of endemic corruption, such that meaningful reform is no longer possible by the soap, ballot, or jury boxes?
      - ctvo 4y ago
        Burning the FBI (literally, of course) to the ground will solve your issues? Aren't you missing the military, congress, the executive branch, ... the rest of the government? Or was it merely the start of your insurrection? Being so flippant about this is how January 6th happened. Your original comment wasn't logical, it was tough person on the internet noise.
    - mardifoufs 4y ago
      So any country without civil forfeiture is just following libertarian talking points? You realize america is the exception, and not allowing the police to randomly seize property isn't libertarian? It's complete partisan brain rot to defend FBI asset seizure just to own the imaginary libertarians, or because the FBI is on "your side" now. Abolishing the institution that is so eagerly participating in civil forfeiture would be a pretty moderate position outside the US.
  - cptskippy 4y ago
    > They are routinely overstepping the bounds of civil behavior... What does that even mean? Your argument starts with a statement everyone agrees with, you assert something that's a stretch to believe at best. Then you just start making things up. Finally you assert that absurd action needs to be taken. Why is it possible to burn the FBI to the ground but not reform civil forfeiture? You need to ask yourself who would benefit from dismantling the FBI, because the FBI does a lot more than civil forfeiture. The same goes for the Post Office and IRS. Someone else has a lot more to gain from dismantling those institutions than you do. They're just riling you up to carry out their agenda.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
- tyingq 4y ago
  "Please cite where the FBI failed to follow the law in this case. The FBI is a law enforcement agency." There's this: A federal prosecutor told Amazon's Pat Stokes that DOJ "seized the money too early" and that being forced to "prove" its seizure with evidence would have a "negative impact."
  - anonuser123456 4y ago
    That doesn’t mean they failed to follow the law. They can lawfully seize assets and later decide they were wrong/premature.
    - tyingq 4y ago
      That statement is from a prosecutor, who would have been as generous to the DOJ/FBI as possible in their wording. That it still sounds bad is telling.
  - deelowe 4y ago
    The doj isn’t the fbi
    - DannyBee 4y ago
      Yes, the DOJ is a superset. the FBI is part of the DOJ and the AG is overall responsible for them. It is the investigative arm of the DOJ. Their procedures and powers are covered by guidelines (a public set and a classified set) issued by the AG
- dang 4y ago
  Please don't cross into flamewar swipes. Your comment would be fine without the last sentence. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- mardifoufs 4y ago
  I guess "defund the police" is a libertarian talking point now?

ctvo 4y ago

Please cite where the FBI failed to follow the law in this case. The FBI is a law enforcement agency. If you have an issue with the law, that's separate. In this case it appears the law is the issue: > For most of the country’s history, civil forfeiture was an obscure backwater. At the time of the Founding, civil forfeiture was limited to confiscating ships and cargo that ran afoul of customs duties. But now civil forfeiture has become wildly popular across law enforcement, precisely because it doesn’t require a criminal conviction, or even an indictment, to confiscate someone’s property. Empty talking points from conspiracy videos you saw on Youtube aren't helpful.

voakbasda 4y ago
Civil forfeiture is legalized theft. Rationalize its legality all you want, but it is the government agents acting like criminals. This kind of behavior flagrantly steals assets from lawful citizens. They are routinely overstepping the bounds of civil behavior, so these institutions need to be burned to the ground - literally if need be.
- ctvo 4y ago
  > They are routinely overstepping the bounds of civil behavior, so these institutions need to be burned to the ground - literally if need be. Or you know, work on changing the civil forfeiture laws and save the libertarian revolt talk for another issue?
  - DaniloDias 4y ago
    [dead]
  - voakbasda 4y ago
    Because I do not believe for one second that such a policy can be reformed? That our system has reached a stable state of endemic corruption, such that meaningful reform is no longer possible by the soap, ballot, or jury boxes?
    - ctvo 4y ago
      Burning the FBI (literally, of course) to the ground will solve your issues? Aren't you missing the military, congress, the executive branch, ... the rest of the government? Or was it merely the start of your insurrection? Being so flippant about this is how January 6th happened. Your original comment wasn't logical, it was tough person on the internet noise.
  - mardifoufs 4y ago
    So any country without civil forfeiture is just following libertarian talking points? You realize america is the exception, and not allowing the police to randomly seize property isn't libertarian? It's complete partisan brain rot to defend FBI asset seizure just to own the imaginary libertarians, or because the FBI is on "your side" now. Abolishing the institution that is so eagerly participating in civil forfeiture would be a pretty moderate position outside the US.
- cptskippy 4y ago
  > They are routinely overstepping the bounds of civil behavior... What does that even mean? Your argument starts with a statement everyone agrees with, you assert something that's a stretch to believe at best. Then you just start making things up. Finally you assert that absurd action needs to be taken. Why is it possible to burn the FBI to the ground but not reform civil forfeiture? You need to ask yourself who would benefit from dismantling the FBI, because the FBI does a lot more than civil forfeiture. The same goes for the Post Office and IRS. Someone else has a lot more to gain from dismantling those institutions than you do. They're just riling you up to carry out their agenda.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
tyingq 4y ago
"Please cite where the FBI failed to follow the law in this case. The FBI is a law enforcement agency." There's this: A federal prosecutor told Amazon's Pat Stokes that DOJ "seized the money too early" and that being forced to "prove" its seizure with evidence would have a "negative impact."
- anonuser123456 4y ago
  That doesn’t mean they failed to follow the law. They can lawfully seize assets and later decide they were wrong/premature.
  - tyingq 4y ago
    That statement is from a prosecutor, who would have been as generous to the DOJ/FBI as possible in their wording. That it still sounds bad is telling.
- deelowe 4y ago
  The doj isn’t the fbi
  - DannyBee 4y ago
    Yes, the DOJ is a superset. the FBI is part of the DOJ and the AG is overall responsible for them. It is the investigative arm of the DOJ. Their procedures and powers are covered by guidelines (a public set and a classified set) issued by the AG
dang 4y ago
Please don't cross into flamewar swipes. Your comment would be fine without the last sentence. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
mardifoufs 4y ago
I guess "defund the police" is a libertarian talking point now?