5 ms·

> Approximately 5-6yrs ago the transit quality in the outer-boroughs (not Manhattan) became so bad that you could spend 2hrs hours switching multiple trains if

> Approximately 5-6yrs ago the transit quality in the outer-boroughs (not Manhattan) became so bad that you could spend 2hrs hours switching multiple trains if you were going into Brooklyn. Trains would mysteriously not arrive, would run express, would claim they have arrived on official apps but the station was closed, etc. Then you think -- in 2hrs I could have commuted into the suburb and lived in a beautiful home for half the price and have a huge garden. And lots of people did exactly that. You're talking about the "summer of hell" on the subways, which was over 5 years ago at this point[1]. I grew up in Manhattan and currently live in Brooklyn (in an "average" neighborhood for transit; neither accessible nor inaccessible), and transit has been fine for at least the past 3 years. You can see the improvement in the MTA's own statistics[2]. This year so far has been slightly lower than 2021, but the overall trend is positive. > Schooling was increasing byzantine. You could own a home but not be guaranteed a seat at your local public school. You had to use "connections" just to make it on the list, or your child would end up half way across the Borough at a different public school. You could have two kids zoned to the same public school, but end up in two different public schools, making school drops impossible. Test-driven systems were changed, making things even harder. "Leadership" based public school application systems were proposed, which is a euphemism for "rich people" get accepted. I won't claim that this has gotten better or worse, but my perspective from going to public schools is that there's always been a degree of this. The historical testing scheme is a way to ensure that rich people get access to the better NYC public schools: the standardized tests are laughably easy to prep for, and every UWS and UES'er of means for the past three generations has thrown money at tutors and test prep for their mediocre children. [1]: https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/07/24/public-transits-summer-of-hell https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/07/24/public-transit... [2]: http://dashboard.mta.info/ http://dashboard.mta.info/

TuringNYC 4y ago
w/r/t http://dashboard.mta.info/ http://dashboard.mta.info/ -- I have a feeling that some of these are timed/theoretical/simulated rather than actual (or at least were at a point.) I literally took photos (need to find them) of cases where the dashboard would show subways arriving but the station/track/side was yellow-taped off.
- woodruffw 4y ago
  The technique used to calculate APT/ATT (the underlying metrics for timeliness) are documented here (you have to click through a few folds)[1]. They don't appear to be simulated or theoretical: they're based on riders' swipes into the system. They do make certain ridership assumptions, however, because of the limited data (e.g. that customers use the same "corridor" during weekdays, and that the next swipe-in corresponds roughly to the last exit during weekdays). Those assumptions don't strike me as unreasonable, given the MTA's inability to collect exit data. Edit: The page goes into detail on those restrictions as well. Interestingly, it sounds like OMNY gives them more precise timestamps, and thus has allowed them to improve the quality of the their metrics over the past ~2 years. The fact that they haven't swung substantially during OMNY's rollout indicates that there wasn't significant error in the previous data. [1]: http://dashboard.mta.info/Help http://dashboard.mta.info/Help
  - TuringNYC 4y ago
    One of the challenges of "poor-er" people...e.g. those on local stops in outer-boroughs is the curse of express trains running past their stops. They are expected to switch again and come back to the stop where they should have stopped anyway. Subway metrics show the trains are operational, but they arent -- it is people adding 20-30+min to a commute because only half the station is operational. Meanwhile the metrics (and exit counts) will show regular operation. Sharing dashboards like these suggest a working system when it isnt actually working that well.
    - woodruffw 4y ago
      That's a great point, and I agree: the subway doesn't do a uniformly good job of serving the city's population. There's a reason the wealthy areas are around the lines that they're around. That being said: that's been true for 100 years. The claim (which I agree with!) that the subway experience is worse when poor doesn't have the temporal aspect that your original claim did (that subway performance has gotten worse recently.)

TuringNYC 4y ago

w/r/t http://dashboard.mta.info/ http://dashboard.mta.info/ -- I have a feeling that some of these are timed/theoretical/simulated rather than actual (or at least were at a point.) I literally took photos (need to find them) of cases where the dashboard would show subways arriving but the station/track/side was yellow-taped off.

woodruffw 4y ago
The technique used to calculate APT/ATT (the underlying metrics for timeliness) are documented here (you have to click through a few folds)[1]. They don't appear to be simulated or theoretical: they're based on riders' swipes into the system. They do make certain ridership assumptions, however, because of the limited data (e.g. that customers use the same "corridor" during weekdays, and that the next swipe-in corresponds roughly to the last exit during weekdays). Those assumptions don't strike me as unreasonable, given the MTA's inability to collect exit data. Edit: The page goes into detail on those restrictions as well. Interestingly, it sounds like OMNY gives them more precise timestamps, and thus has allowed them to improve the quality of the their metrics over the past ~2 years. The fact that they haven't swung substantially during OMNY's rollout indicates that there wasn't significant error in the previous data. [1]: http://dashboard.mta.info/Help http://dashboard.mta.info/Help
- TuringNYC 4y ago
  One of the challenges of "poor-er" people...e.g. those on local stops in outer-boroughs is the curse of express trains running past their stops. They are expected to switch again and come back to the stop where they should have stopped anyway. Subway metrics show the trains are operational, but they arent -- it is people adding 20-30+min to a commute because only half the station is operational. Meanwhile the metrics (and exit counts) will show regular operation. Sharing dashboards like these suggest a working system when it isnt actually working that well.
  - woodruffw 4y ago
    That's a great point, and I agree: the subway doesn't do a uniformly good job of serving the city's population. There's a reason the wealthy areas are around the lines that they're around. That being said: that's been true for 100 years. The claim (which I agree with!) that the subway experience is worse when poor doesn't have the temporal aspect that your original claim did (that subway performance has gotten worse recently.)