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Wait until you find out Henry Ford’s politics. Or Volkswagon’s history. Although obviously it’s not as bad as a man promoting free speech and criticizing postmo

Wait until you find out Henry Ford’s politics. Or Volkswagon’s history. Although obviously it’s not as bad as a man promoting free speech and criticizing postmodernism.

hotcoffeebear 4y ago
How many decades ago are we talking about?
ethanbond 4y ago
Surely there's no difference between people who have been dead for decades and someone who chooses every day to actively put himself in the spotlight by doing stuff ranging from stupid to awful. Really sad fall from grace for Elon. Could've just kept working.
vanilla_nut 4y ago
Sure, plenty of other carmakers have committed vile sins. But the Musk Twitter nonsense is very current, which makes it harder to stomach than Henry Ford's anti-semitism over 100 years ago. And let's not pretend Elon is sticking up for "free speech." He's censoring folks who don't agree with him. That isn't free speech, unless you subscribe to fascist definitions of "free speech."
- bilbo0s 4y ago
  the Musk Twitter nonsense is very current I don't understand how people don't get this? It's like saying "Trump's bad, but what about Thomas Jefferson and slavery!" It just leaves people scratching their heads.
- newZWhoDis 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - vgt 4y ago
    https://www.theverge.com/2022/12/15/23512004/elon-musk-starts-banning-critical-journalists-from-twitter https://www.theverge.com/2022/12/15/23512004/elon-musk-start... https://time.com/6229960/twitter-bans-accounts-elon-musk-impersonators/ https://time.com/6229960/twitter-bans-accounts-elon-musk-imp...
  - ModernMech 4y ago
    > Users were banned for impersonation, which was against the rules prior to Elon. Musk said he was going to only ban people for violating the law. It is not against the law to parody someone without identifying that you are a parody. Musk banning these accounts may be fine from your perspective, but not from an absolute free speech perspective. > 2) Banning the jet tracker, while wrong, makes sense Doesn’t make sense from the perspective of free speech absolutism. A lot of the bans pre-Musk made sense, like banning Trump for using the platform to foment insurrection. But Musk railed against those actions as examples of censorship, and promised not to operate that way. Instead, he is operating exactly that way. I don’t have a problem with that as it’s his platform, but he 100% went back on his promise as soon as he got control. > Edit: I can’t reply to you because of dangs rate limit. Your articles are complete bullshit. You’ve been rate limited for a reason. Please don’t try to get around the rate limit by editing your posts.
- mathaway 4y ago
  There is no one currently banned on Twitter by Musk for personal dislike. The only person he’s being unprincipled against is Alex Jones.
TheCoelacanth 4y ago
It's not just his politics. He's running Twitter in a very erratic manner and demonstrating very poor judgement. It's completely reasonable not to trust someone like that with your family's safety.
benj111 4y ago
Is he promoting free speech? Last I heard he had deleted a load of journalists accounts, before that it was deleting parady accounts. What concrete thing has he done for free speech other than offer trump his account back?
ivalm 4y ago
He is banning people sometimes for policies he introduced after the fact, sometimes without policy violations at all. “Free speech” is just not a defendable position for his behavior, he does not subscribe or support free speech.
- newZWhoDis 4y ago
  Twitter moderation was famously bad before Elon, and has seemingly only slightly improved. What Elon has done however is put the spotlight on Twitter, almost every issue people have with it is a “preexisting condition”.
  - ivalm 4y ago
    Except he banned a bunch of journalists discussing him using a policy he introduced after the fact, and in one case, without violation at all. His active actions, not pre-existing conditions, reveal his preference against free speech.
- mathaway 4y ago
  Who is banned from Twitter now that Musk banned? The lunatics that ran it for years banned people wantonly with vague reasons without any remedy for 5+ years in some cases. Musk revealed files implicating the FBI, CIA and Pentagon but oh my God he voted Republican so he’s evil!
rsynnott 4y ago
I mean, I think you’ll find that Henry Ford is dead. In general, “past, extremely dead, person was awful; this excuses the current awful person” is _not_ a great argument. It also seems to be a fairly new invention; I’ve only really seen it in the last decade. Not even going to address the free speech thing, except to say that you must be using a very 1984 “war is peace” sort of definition there…

Wait until you find out Henry Ford’s politics. Or Volkswagon’s history. Although obviously it’s not as bad as a man promoting free speech and criticizing postmodernism.

hotcoffeebear 4y ago

How many decades ago are we talking about?

ethanbond 4y ago

Surely there's no difference between people who have been dead for decades and someone who chooses every day to actively put himself in the spotlight by doing stuff ranging from stupid to awful. Really sad fall from grace for Elon. Could've just kept working.

vanilla_nut 4y ago

Sure, plenty of other carmakers have committed vile sins. But the Musk Twitter nonsense is very current, which makes it harder to stomach than Henry Ford's anti-semitism over 100 years ago. And let's not pretend Elon is sticking up for "free speech." He's censoring folks who don't agree with him. That isn't free speech, unless you subscribe to fascist definitions of "free speech."

bilbo0s 4y ago
the Musk Twitter nonsense is very current I don't understand how people don't get this? It's like saying "Trump's bad, but what about Thomas Jefferson and slavery!" It just leaves people scratching their heads.
newZWhoDis 4y ago
[flagged]
- vgt 4y ago
  https://www.theverge.com/2022/12/15/23512004/elon-musk-starts-banning-critical-journalists-from-twitter https://www.theverge.com/2022/12/15/23512004/elon-musk-start... https://time.com/6229960/twitter-bans-accounts-elon-musk-impersonators/ https://time.com/6229960/twitter-bans-accounts-elon-musk-imp...
- ModernMech 4y ago
  > Users were banned for impersonation, which was against the rules prior to Elon. Musk said he was going to only ban people for violating the law. It is not against the law to parody someone without identifying that you are a parody. Musk banning these accounts may be fine from your perspective, but not from an absolute free speech perspective. > 2) Banning the jet tracker, while wrong, makes sense Doesn’t make sense from the perspective of free speech absolutism. A lot of the bans pre-Musk made sense, like banning Trump for using the platform to foment insurrection. But Musk railed against those actions as examples of censorship, and promised not to operate that way. Instead, he is operating exactly that way. I don’t have a problem with that as it’s his platform, but he 100% went back on his promise as soon as he got control. > Edit: I can’t reply to you because of dangs rate limit. Your articles are complete bullshit. You’ve been rate limited for a reason. Please don’t try to get around the rate limit by editing your posts.
mathaway 4y ago
There is no one currently banned on Twitter by Musk for personal dislike. The only person he’s being unprincipled against is Alex Jones.

TheCoelacanth 4y ago

It's not just his politics. He's running Twitter in a very erratic manner and demonstrating very poor judgement. It's completely reasonable not to trust someone like that with your family's safety.

benj111 4y ago

Is he promoting free speech? Last I heard he had deleted a load of journalists accounts, before that it was deleting parady accounts. What concrete thing has he done for free speech other than offer trump his account back?

ivalm 4y ago

He is banning people sometimes for policies he introduced after the fact, sometimes without policy violations at all. “Free speech” is just not a defendable position for his behavior, he does not subscribe or support free speech.

newZWhoDis 4y ago
Twitter moderation was famously bad before Elon, and has seemingly only slightly improved. What Elon has done however is put the spotlight on Twitter, almost every issue people have with it is a “preexisting condition”.
- ivalm 4y ago
  Except he banned a bunch of journalists discussing him using a policy he introduced after the fact, and in one case, without violation at all. His active actions, not pre-existing conditions, reveal his preference against free speech.
mathaway 4y ago
Who is banned from Twitter now that Musk banned? The lunatics that ran it for years banned people wantonly with vague reasons without any remedy for 5+ years in some cases. Musk revealed files implicating the FBI, CIA and Pentagon but oh my God he voted Republican so he’s evil!

rsynnott 4y ago

I mean, I think you’ll find that Henry Ford is dead. In general, “past, extremely dead, person was awful; this excuses the current awful person” is _not_ a great argument. It also seems to be a fairly new invention; I’ve only really seen it in the last decade. Not even going to address the free speech thing, except to say that you must be using a very 1984 “war is peace” sort of definition there…