4 ms·

Basically what I read was the former CEO was accountant educated and focused on stock price and financials and ignored system upgrades for like a decade. That

Basically what I read was the former CEO was accountant educated and focused on stock price and financials and ignored system upgrades for like a decade. That coupled with their decentralized nature of operating (no hubs or star pattern) the recent storms caused their systems to not “know” where people or planes were even though the people knew where they were. That knowledge is the critical feature because hours of fly-time for pilots and airplanes is crucial for legally mandated rest periods, maintenance and logistics. Having personally experienced the delays and issues with SW earlier this year I can suggest not flying them other than direct flights. Them not having any hubs means if one plane is late or a crew times out because of delays you are stranded. We got stranded at one airport overnight and got routed thru 2 other airports, changing planes at one, before reaching our destination. They have zero capacity of crews/planes on standby at any airport, probably because of the former CEO leadership and pandemic complications.

ww520 4y ago
Ah so bean counting treated IT as a cost center and cut CapEx to the bone. Running things with no reserved capacity, crew wise and system wise, is just asking for a catastrophic fall off the cliff style shutdown. Edit: a simple queue theory can explain why no reserved capacity leads to system breakdown.
- mattbrewsbytes 4y ago
  Yup. For me they had brand prominence because of various customer friendly things like bags fly free, sit where you want, etc. It will take a mountain of good reports from other people over a significant period of time for me to want to fly with them.
  - jen20 4y ago
    This is the first time I’ve ever seen the plane-boarding hunger games of sit-where-you-like referred to as a customer-friendly thing.
    - n8cpdx 4y ago
      Absolutely love it, choice of window or aisle seat is guaranteed if you’re not obsessed with being the very first person off the plane. Also in practice Southwest’s system is the fastest way to board.
    - ethbr0 4y ago
      People either love it or hate it. Personally, having flown with them for business for 5 or so years, I generally preferred it to assigned seating.
      - kube-system 4y ago
        Yes, I like it when flying alone. On other airlines you get to choose where your seat is at. On Southwest you get to choose who you sit beside.
    - Icathian 4y ago
      I'll add another data point of strongly preferring it. Check in early so you can board early so you can get a good seat. I'm fairly punctual and this system rewards me for that without needing to open my wallet, so I'm a fan. That said I agree with the grandparent comment about avoiding them for the foreseeable future based on this fiasco. Hopefully they get it together at some point.
  - jeffwask 4y ago
    They were also among the cheapest flights available now they are among the most expensive and their little extra's don't cover the difference.
- foobarian 4y ago
  The question is, will they still come out ahead even accounting for the catastrophic shutdown? Maybe once a year is fine
  - ww520 4y ago
    Another question is should the executive bonus be crawled back for the rising stock by the cost cutting which leads to catastrophic shutdown due to deferred maintenance.
wwweston 4y ago
> Having personally experienced the delays and issues with SW earlier this year I can suggest not flying them other than direct flights And it seems to me they've cut direct flights -- still plentiful on many of the hops (say, LAS <-> LAX) but scarcer on longer routes (say SLC <-> LAX). And on the shorter routes, driving is roughly competitive time-wise...
ethbr0 4y ago
Not sure it's as cut and dry as "CFO becomes CEO and overly focuses on financials" in Southwest's case. In 2021, Gary Kelly (former CFO/CEO) announced his retirement and picked Bob Jordan (CS trained, having previously worked on the AirTran integration) to take over as CEO, which seems a realization that Southwest has some serious technical debt to address. All businesses have highest priorities at a given point in time. In Southwest's early years, they were legal and operational, hence Herb Kelleher. 2000-2020, I can't say financials weren't top of the list, as Southwest migrated off its older plane models. 2020+, maybe they're technical. A good company picks the CEO it needs for the moment, not always one particular type.
- cowmoo728 4y ago
  But the Southwest pilot's union is accusing the former CEO, Gary Kelly, of running the company at full speed into operational suicide. I don't see that as picking the right CEO for the moment, even if the stock price did well.
  - kevin_thibedeau 4y ago
    Classic Jack Welch move. Get out before the shit you created hits the fan and leave the next guy to deal with it.
  - ethbr0 4y ago
    The pilot's union doesn't have a monopoly on truth. They would always like to be paid more and work less, as would I! Are they accurate or inaccurate? I can't say. Were they unionized, I'm sure the Twitter employee's union would be crying bloody murder right now. But it's fair to say that organizationally Twitter had a lot of headcount for their product. And when you tighten a financial belt, employees are going to be unhappy.

ww520 4y ago

Ah so bean counting treated IT as a cost center and cut CapEx to the bone. Running things with no reserved capacity, crew wise and system wise, is just asking for a catastrophic fall off the cliff style shutdown. Edit: a simple queue theory can explain why no reserved capacity leads to system breakdown.

mattbrewsbytes 4y ago
Yup. For me they had brand prominence because of various customer friendly things like bags fly free, sit where you want, etc. It will take a mountain of good reports from other people over a significant period of time for me to want to fly with them.
- jen20 4y ago
  This is the first time I’ve ever seen the plane-boarding hunger games of sit-where-you-like referred to as a customer-friendly thing.
  - n8cpdx 4y ago
    Absolutely love it, choice of window or aisle seat is guaranteed if you’re not obsessed with being the very first person off the plane. Also in practice Southwest’s system is the fastest way to board.
  - ethbr0 4y ago
    People either love it or hate it. Personally, having flown with them for business for 5 or so years, I generally preferred it to assigned seating.
    - kube-system 4y ago
      Yes, I like it when flying alone. On other airlines you get to choose where your seat is at. On Southwest you get to choose who you sit beside.
  - Icathian 4y ago
    I'll add another data point of strongly preferring it. Check in early so you can board early so you can get a good seat. I'm fairly punctual and this system rewards me for that without needing to open my wallet, so I'm a fan. That said I agree with the grandparent comment about avoiding them for the foreseeable future based on this fiasco. Hopefully they get it together at some point.
- jeffwask 4y ago
  They were also among the cheapest flights available now they are among the most expensive and their little extra's don't cover the difference.
foobarian 4y ago
The question is, will they still come out ahead even accounting for the catastrophic shutdown? Maybe once a year is fine
- ww520 4y ago
  Another question is should the executive bonus be crawled back for the rising stock by the cost cutting which leads to catastrophic shutdown due to deferred maintenance.

wwweston 4y ago

> Having personally experienced the delays and issues with SW earlier this year I can suggest not flying them other than direct flights And it seems to me they've cut direct flights -- still plentiful on many of the hops (say, LAS <-> LAX) but scarcer on longer routes (say SLC <-> LAX). And on the shorter routes, driving is roughly competitive time-wise...

ethbr0 4y ago

Not sure it's as cut and dry as "CFO becomes CEO and overly focuses on financials" in Southwest's case. In 2021, Gary Kelly (former CFO/CEO) announced his retirement and picked Bob Jordan (CS trained, having previously worked on the AirTran integration) to take over as CEO, which seems a realization that Southwest has some serious technical debt to address. All businesses have highest priorities at a given point in time. In Southwest's early years, they were legal and operational, hence Herb Kelleher. 2000-2020, I can't say financials weren't top of the list, as Southwest migrated off its older plane models. 2020+, maybe they're technical. A good company picks the CEO it needs for the moment, not always one particular type.

cowmoo728 4y ago
But the Southwest pilot's union is accusing the former CEO, Gary Kelly, of running the company at full speed into operational suicide. I don't see that as picking the right CEO for the moment, even if the stock price did well.
- kevin_thibedeau 4y ago
  Classic Jack Welch move. Get out before the shit you created hits the fan and leave the next guy to deal with it.
- ethbr0 4y ago
  The pilot's union doesn't have a monopoly on truth. They would always like to be paid more and work less, as would I! Are they accurate or inaccurate? I can't say. Were they unionized, I'm sure the Twitter employee's union would be crying bloody murder right now. But it's fair to say that organizationally Twitter had a lot of headcount for their product. And when you tighten a financial belt, employees are going to be unhappy.