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I agree with the article that it's not facebook. You're depressed, dont feel like doing anything but know you should, so you procrastinate on facebook, and then

I agree with the article that it's not facebook. You're depressed, dont feel like doing anything but know you should, so you procrastinate on facebook, and then maybe the whole day passes, and the waste of another day makes it feel like nothing is going to change, helping feed your depression. Facebook really has little to do with this... if it wasnt facebook, it would be youtube, instagram, watching tv, or sleeping all day. These people are depressed... they need help to improve their condition. Taking away facebook will not make them un-depressed. Thats not how depression works.

uncletammy 4y ago
> Taking away facebook will not make them un-depressed. Although I agree that Facebook isn't the problem here, taking it away might be a necessary first step.
- baby 4y ago
  The problem is that you can’t take it away. If it’s not fb it’s tiktok, or youtube, or instagram, or reddit, or HN, or emails, or rss feeds, or food, or video games, or …
  - jezzamon 4y ago
    All of those bar one can be done by physically separating yourself from technology, which is quite feasible in short periods. Downgrading to a dumb phone works ok too (until you need to work with some service that requires an app)
  - tgv 4y ago
    > fb ... tiktok, or youtube, or instagram, or reddit, or HN, or emails, or rss feeds, or food, or video games Is the question: which of these is not like the rest? Furthermore, you deny two things: firstly, that the influence of facebook is real, and secondly, that other forms of (social) media can have a different effect. E.g., RSS is totally unlike facebook. And let's ignore you mentioned food.
    - annyeonghada 4y ago
      Food is definitely an obsession during my depressive episodes, especially if there is a suicidal component. I think constantly about food, I'm always hungry but at the same time everything disgusts me, I would like to not have to eat anymore: this ends up in a bulimic episode where I gorge everything in side, searching for something that fills that void and that taste just good, then I fast for 20-30 hours completely disgusted about what I've done.
      - tgv 4y ago
        The unfortunate thing is: we can't live without food. We can't switch it off. It doesn't disappear when we throw our mobile phone in the garbage can. > completely disgusted about what I've done Sorry to hear that. I sometimes eat out of boredom/anxiety too; it's almost unavoidable. Don't feel too bad. It helps me to simply not buy the things I like. You do have to do your shopping every day, though. But remember: this internet stranger isn't disgusted by you.
    - kixiQu 4y ago
      I want to read the first-person essay about someone in the 2020s dealing with depression and developing a problematic avoidant-escapist relationship with emails. Does this person even exist? Maybe; if so, I am fascinated.
      - baby 4y ago
        It used to be THE addiction that most books on work and productivity used to talk about. These days perhaps slack is in the top as well.
    - baby 4y ago
      I’m not sure I understand how you differentiate these in terms of how they can be addictive and negative for your life in unreasonable amounts. For example, RSS used to be the worst for me personally. I was severely addicted to my feed.
  - numpad0 4y ago
    No we’re not taking it away from you, we’re just … marshaling your daily tasks to make rooms for vital additions solely for your recovery. Now get up, get clothed, and stand over that X marked in your backyard. Good. I’ll count from 1800, 1799, 1798…
kneebonian 4y ago
This is me with HN and Reddit. I have spent literal entire workdays just telling myself "5 more minutes" "one more post" it never ends well. I hate myself for it but we are doing better, i have a time blocker and if things get bad I can use my /etc/hosts file to block it. But I agree I think these may be symptoms that worsen something already there.
- GalenErso 4y ago
  Something I've done that worked for me was set my Reddit password to a long string of characters that I couldn't easily memorize, so I couldn't log in on my phone if I wanted. I also force myself to nuke my accounts from time to time, so I don't get attached to them too much.
- jraby3 4y ago
  What’s really grounded me is using a habit tracker and forcing myself to keep a string of positive habits alive - working out, meditation, writing, etc. Good habits keep me grounded when I’m feeling lost. Something I do to block Reddit addiction is delete the app, log in through a private window (so I have to retype my password). Sometimes I also use a time limit.
johnfn 4y ago
> Facebook really has little to do with this... if it wasnt facebook, it would be youtube, instagram, watching tv, or sleeping all day. …or you could end up doing something to improve your situation, like taking a walk outside or going to the gym. It’s kinda like saying vapes aren’t a problem because you would just get a cigarette.
- madmads 4y ago
  In this case, if the individual is diagnosed with depression, taking away an escape from reality like Facebook doesn't solve the depression. Like they said, a depressed person will find something else to substitute Facebook. Depression needs actual treatment in most cases. The analogy to vaping and smoking doesn't exactly work.
  - spikeagally 4y ago
    [dead]
  - tgv 4y ago
    The article literally says facebook aggravates depression. It's in the title. In this context, you can't just argue that taking away facebook doesn't help without reasons not to trust the article.
    - Sebb767 4y ago
      It's like a headline saying Budweiser fosters alcoholism. Yes, alcoholics will be worse off if they drink Budweiser and yes, Budweiser does in some way foster alcoholism by producing and selling alcohol, but it's a very narrow picture to paint Budweiser as the sole perpetrator, which is heavily implied by the headline. I hate Facebook as much as the next guy, but in this case, singling it out like this is neither fair nor helpful. Just like shutting down Budweiser would do nothing to reduce alcoholism.
      - baby 4y ago
        It’s also a bad faith argument as it ignores the positive aspect that it provides for many people.
swayvil 4y ago
No, it really is Facebook. Facebook provides a temptation. Like a table full of cookies over the holidays. Of course you are going to visit that table a hundred times a day. Even though it isn't really very healthy. And then when the holidays are over your diet will improve. We are not Nietzschean creatures of pure will. The temptation-landscape significates.
- baby 4y ago
  Temptation is everywhere. Every app today is trying to maximize your time spent there.
  - swayvil 4y ago
    Temptation has legendary threat value. How does that ancient Christian prayer go? ...Lead me not into temptation... What did Satan do to Jesus when he was fasting? He zapped Jesus with lightning? No, he tempted him. What did Mara do to Buddha...
fullshark 4y ago
Maybe I'm overthinking this but this seems kind of an odd takeaway, and bringing it front and center is a bit of slight of hand. You're refuting a claim that's not in the headline but I guess what you think a reader's next logical step would be?: Finding: Facebook makes already depressed people more depressed -> Claim: Facebook makes undepressed people depressed. The 2nd is not claimed, the first is the result and I think facebook has a lot of do with this.
hyuuu 4y ago
All of these comments that are trying to pin it back to facebook is quite interesting. Whatever hole the depression creates will be filled by any other content consumption, may it be TikTok, Youtube, Reddit, etc but there is a big pattern, time and time again, to single out Facebook. Why is that? Youtube spreads misinformation too, most recently about election if I recall correctly. I mean hell, there are subreddits that full on organize crime / hate speech, all of them are just as bad, however facebook, every single time, always gets the active hate. I guess this is why PR is an industry, yes I just now realize this as I type the whole thing haha.
- spikeagally 4y ago
  [dead]
thewataccount 4y ago
Similarly that's also how addiction as a disease works. Clinical addictions generally imply more use than originally intended, some type of inability to quit, and some type of "significant impact" on school/work/relationships/goals. These are known risk factors for developing depression, and of course worsening it. More studies are good, but from a news perspective, "addiction increases depression severity" is hardly surprising regardless of what the addiction is.
tim-montague 4y ago
> Facebook really has little to do with this... "Facebook addiction increases depression" - so yes it does. However, I think we need more companies like FourHere, Humane, etc. that want to fix the harm that social media causes.

uncletammy 4y ago

> Taking away facebook will not make them un-depressed. Although I agree that Facebook isn't the problem here, taking it away might be a necessary first step.

baby 4y ago
The problem is that you can’t take it away. If it’s not fb it’s tiktok, or youtube, or instagram, or reddit, or HN, or emails, or rss feeds, or food, or video games, or …
- jezzamon 4y ago
  All of those bar one can be done by physically separating yourself from technology, which is quite feasible in short periods. Downgrading to a dumb phone works ok too (until you need to work with some service that requires an app)
- tgv 4y ago
  > fb ... tiktok, or youtube, or instagram, or reddit, or HN, or emails, or rss feeds, or food, or video games Is the question: which of these is not like the rest? Furthermore, you deny two things: firstly, that the influence of facebook is real, and secondly, that other forms of (social) media can have a different effect. E.g., RSS is totally unlike facebook. And let's ignore you mentioned food.
  - annyeonghada 4y ago
    Food is definitely an obsession during my depressive episodes, especially if there is a suicidal component. I think constantly about food, I'm always hungry but at the same time everything disgusts me, I would like to not have to eat anymore: this ends up in a bulimic episode where I gorge everything in side, searching for something that fills that void and that taste just good, then I fast for 20-30 hours completely disgusted about what I've done.
    - tgv 4y ago
      The unfortunate thing is: we can't live without food. We can't switch it off. It doesn't disappear when we throw our mobile phone in the garbage can. > completely disgusted about what I've done Sorry to hear that. I sometimes eat out of boredom/anxiety too; it's almost unavoidable. Don't feel too bad. It helps me to simply not buy the things I like. You do have to do your shopping every day, though. But remember: this internet stranger isn't disgusted by you.
  - kixiQu 4y ago
    I want to read the first-person essay about someone in the 2020s dealing with depression and developing a problematic avoidant-escapist relationship with emails. Does this person even exist? Maybe; if so, I am fascinated.
    - baby 4y ago
      It used to be THE addiction that most books on work and productivity used to talk about. These days perhaps slack is in the top as well.
  - baby 4y ago
    I’m not sure I understand how you differentiate these in terms of how they can be addictive and negative for your life in unreasonable amounts. For example, RSS used to be the worst for me personally. I was severely addicted to my feed.
- numpad0 4y ago
  No we’re not taking it away from you, we’re just … marshaling your daily tasks to make rooms for vital additions solely for your recovery. Now get up, get clothed, and stand over that X marked in your backyard. Good. I’ll count from 1800, 1799, 1798…

kneebonian 4y ago

This is me with HN and Reddit. I have spent literal entire workdays just telling myself "5 more minutes" "one more post" it never ends well. I hate myself for it but we are doing better, i have a time blocker and if things get bad I can use my /etc/hosts file to block it. But I agree I think these may be symptoms that worsen something already there.

GalenErso 4y ago
Something I've done that worked for me was set my Reddit password to a long string of characters that I couldn't easily memorize, so I couldn't log in on my phone if I wanted. I also force myself to nuke my accounts from time to time, so I don't get attached to them too much.
jraby3 4y ago
What’s really grounded me is using a habit tracker and forcing myself to keep a string of positive habits alive - working out, meditation, writing, etc. Good habits keep me grounded when I’m feeling lost. Something I do to block Reddit addiction is delete the app, log in through a private window (so I have to retype my password). Sometimes I also use a time limit.

johnfn 4y ago

> Facebook really has little to do with this... if it wasnt facebook, it would be youtube, instagram, watching tv, or sleeping all day. …or you could end up doing something to improve your situation, like taking a walk outside or going to the gym. It’s kinda like saying vapes aren’t a problem because you would just get a cigarette.

madmads 4y ago
In this case, if the individual is diagnosed with depression, taking away an escape from reality like Facebook doesn't solve the depression. Like they said, a depressed person will find something else to substitute Facebook. Depression needs actual treatment in most cases. The analogy to vaping and smoking doesn't exactly work.
- spikeagally 4y ago
  [dead]
- tgv 4y ago
  The article literally says facebook aggravates depression. It's in the title. In this context, you can't just argue that taking away facebook doesn't help without reasons not to trust the article.
  - Sebb767 4y ago
    It's like a headline saying Budweiser fosters alcoholism. Yes, alcoholics will be worse off if they drink Budweiser and yes, Budweiser does in some way foster alcoholism by producing and selling alcohol, but it's a very narrow picture to paint Budweiser as the sole perpetrator, which is heavily implied by the headline. I hate Facebook as much as the next guy, but in this case, singling it out like this is neither fair nor helpful. Just like shutting down Budweiser would do nothing to reduce alcoholism.
    - baby 4y ago
      It’s also a bad faith argument as it ignores the positive aspect that it provides for many people.

swayvil 4y ago

No, it really is Facebook. Facebook provides a temptation. Like a table full of cookies over the holidays. Of course you are going to visit that table a hundred times a day. Even though it isn't really very healthy. And then when the holidays are over your diet will improve. We are not Nietzschean creatures of pure will. The temptation-landscape significates.

baby 4y ago
Temptation is everywhere. Every app today is trying to maximize your time spent there.
- swayvil 4y ago
  Temptation has legendary threat value. How does that ancient Christian prayer go? ...Lead me not into temptation... What did Satan do to Jesus when he was fasting? He zapped Jesus with lightning? No, he tempted him. What did Mara do to Buddha...

fullshark 4y ago

Maybe I'm overthinking this but this seems kind of an odd takeaway, and bringing it front and center is a bit of slight of hand. You're refuting a claim that's not in the headline but I guess what you think a reader's next logical step would be?: Finding: Facebook makes already depressed people more depressed -> Claim: Facebook makes undepressed people depressed. The 2nd is not claimed, the first is the result and I think facebook has a lot of do with this.

hyuuu 4y ago

All of these comments that are trying to pin it back to facebook is quite interesting. Whatever hole the depression creates will be filled by any other content consumption, may it be TikTok, Youtube, Reddit, etc but there is a big pattern, time and time again, to single out Facebook. Why is that? Youtube spreads misinformation too, most recently about election if I recall correctly. I mean hell, there are subreddits that full on organize crime / hate speech, all of them are just as bad, however facebook, every single time, always gets the active hate. I guess this is why PR is an industry, yes I just now realize this as I type the whole thing haha.

spikeagally 4y ago
[dead]

thewataccount 4y ago

Similarly that's also how addiction as a disease works. Clinical addictions generally imply more use than originally intended, some type of inability to quit, and some type of "significant impact" on school/work/relationships/goals. These are known risk factors for developing depression, and of course worsening it. More studies are good, but from a news perspective, "addiction increases depression severity" is hardly surprising regardless of what the addiction is.

tim-montague 4y ago

> Facebook really has little to do with this... "Facebook addiction increases depression" - so yes it does. However, I think we need more companies like FourHere, Humane, etc. that want to fix the harm that social media causes.