5 ms·
Why would you hope that more people will do this? Do you see any possible downsides at the individual or societal level?
by throw_pm23 4y ago
Why would you hope that more people will do this?
Do you see any possible downsides at the individual or societal level?
- TaylorAlexander 4y agoI hope more people do this because for me it feels really right, and I find it beautiful. It’s also helping me understand women more. I think our society would benefit from a better understanding of the experiences of the opposite sex, and people who do this can help share this with others so we all have a better understanding. I don’t see any downsides to more people doing this.
- BlargMcLarg 4y agoNorah Vincent basically broke her psyche trying to live as a man, and the story has barely left an impact on the status quo. Similar stories exist among transmen rather than women going incognito, even if in their case it would be to pick their poison. The idea that there are no downsides doesn't mesh with reality.
- 0ct4via 4y ago[flagged]
- BlargMcLarg 4y ago>Norah Vincent wasn't transgender That's what I said. "Women going incognito". >Please back up your statements with evidence. Spend a few days in online circles reading experiences of transmen, then do yourself another solid and spend another few days wading through online circles for men specifically. It's not too hard to see a few transitioners go "well X kinda sucked as a woman but Y definitely sucks now that I am a man". >The fact that you liken HRT to "picking your poison" is ignorant and disingenuous What's disingenuous is your extremely uncharitable interpretation, and I would urge you to take a step back and read with a little more favor towards the writer. Think for a moment by bringing it back to its basis. As a woman with gender dysphoria, you have to pick between undergoing HRT and potentially having disastrous effects on your psyche, or suffering harsher consequences from your dysphoria for living as a woman. To claim there are 'no downsides' when even the people for who the procedure exists have to pick between the lesser of two evils rather than a straight up boost, is completely off the mark. Vincent's example at least suggests women without dysphoria can't just 'live as a man for a bit' without it having downsides. Transitioners experiencing the same despite a net gain due to their unique circumstances would confirm it, more than deny it. You fail to see that the laser focus on trans people is exactly why GP's comment doesn't mesh for the average person, as 'people who seriously desire to do this' are not necessarily people who feel uncomfortable or less comfortable with their own gender. So please, stop making this seem like an attack on trans people. It isn't. It is merely a rebuttal against the idea that men living as women and women living as men, no further qualifiers given, only out of some 'desire to try it', has no downsides.
- zoklet-enjoyer 4y ago[flagged]
- bbbbbp 4y ago[flagged]
- throw_m239339 4y ago[flagged]
- 0ct4via 4y ago[flagged]
- throw_m239339 4y ago[flagged]
- chownie 4y agoNorah Vincent had long term depression and anxiety pre-"self made man", the hysteria surrounding her euthanasia relating it back to her early 00's experimentation is completely baseless, the only sources are ladbible/facebook/etc "news" articles who themselves cite no sources.
- safety1st 4y ago[flagged]
- 0ct4via 4y ago[flagged]
- geraldwhen 4y agoAlcohol has been consumed for millennia and seems to be positively correlated with fertility.
- AstixAndBelix 4y agoWould you be in favor of giving people schizophrenia-inducing drugs, with the risk of having permanent mental effects, so people can understand mental health issues better? These drugs you are taking are no joking matter and your fortuitous lived experience doesn't make your claim less preposterous
- TaylorAlexander 4y agoIt’s a pretty bad example, because the “risk of permanent mental effects” is not a desirable goal, whereas the permanent changes I’m experiencing are things I want. I’m not suggesting that people who don’t want hormone changes try it. I’m suggesting more trans people come out of the closet and try this.
- nraford 4y agoObviously the commitment is massive, but I would love to gender flip for a year or so. It's a bit sci-fi, but the way you described it is so beautiful, I'd love to better under the complete richness and beauty of the human experience from both sides, even if only temporarily. I'm sure the world would be a better place if all had the chance to experience both sides and then chose.
- TaylorAlexander 4y agoIt’s not to be done lightly and I spent 18 months thinking about it before I started HRT, but it sounds like something you might want to consider! I never had strong feelings of being trans, it was something that just started to make sense to me more and more. Anyway either way you’re right I think it’s a pretty neat experience!
- CWuestefeld 4y agoApologies for what may be perceived as everybody jumping on you. It’s also helping me understand women more. I disagree. I think you're understanding your own experience more, but then you've trying to fit that to what you see or hear about from women based on a lot of assumptions that probably aren't valid. Since we have no direct access to the internal mental state of others (and scarcely that of ourselves sometimes!) we can never be sure that we're experiencing what others are. There's a millennia-old thought experiment about imaging how we each experience the color red. How can I know that what you experience when you see an apple or a fire engine is anything like what I experience? If we could stimulate the same neurons in the optic nerve or in the various brain structures, would we each understand the stimulus as "red"? And I think that modern observations of phenomenon like synesthesia suggest that our internal qualia really do differ a lot. That leads me to believe that it's wrong to think that hormones have changed you to experiencing things "the way a woman would", and more strongly, I'm skeptical that there's any set of qualia that can be placed in a bucket as how a woman experiences the world - I think it's absolutely individual. (this also, by the way, makes me question how anyone can believe that their internal experience more closely matches "being a man" or "being a woman")