4 ms·

Wonder how much expats in retirement will increase when people realize they have no chance at living with their savings here.

voisin 4y ago
Costs a lot to expatriate though. Deemed disposition on exit = capital gains.
toomuchtodo 4y ago
It’s already happening with retirees moving to Mexico, Portugal, and Southeast Asia. Agree you’ll see it pickup as more folks retire and can’t make ends meet in the US. Half of retirees over 55 have no retirement savings whatsoever, and will rely solely on Social Security income. https://www.cnbc.com/2022/11/02/retire-abroad-in-these-10-cities-for-less-than-2000-dollars-per-month.html https://www.cnbc.com/2022/11/02/retire-abroad-in-these-10-ci... https://www.aarp.org/retirement/retirement-savings/info-2019/no-retirement-money-saved.html https://www.aarp.org/retirement/retirement-savings/info-2019...
- throwaway1777 4y ago
  Don’t you lose social security if you move outside the us?
  - toomuchtodo 4y ago
    You’re entitled to your Social Security benefits regardless of where you reside globally. You don’t have Medicare coverage outside of the US though. Typically, your Social Security is your passive/pension/monthly income that qualifies you for a long term retirement visa. A hack you can do if you can work remotely is collect Social Security out of the country while working remote; this increases your income and if your annual income replaces previous lower income years on your Social Security wage record, your monthly benefit will go up over time as the SSA re-evaluates your benefit annually (not to mention cost of living adjustments).
- zeroonetwothree 4y ago
  Is this new though? I don’t think people in the past saved much either
  - toomuchtodo 4y ago
    It's a lengthy discussion topic to say the least. High level, pension coverage and associated healthcare plans have declined over the decades, 401ks (they were initially designed as a tax shelter for the wealthy) were parroted as the solution when they weren’t, and with the healthcare arrangement in the US, what might have been sustainable previously no longer is. Hence, people bouncing from an extraction economy to enjoy higher standard of living during the last chapter of their life (because it ain’t getting fixed in the US in a timeframe that matters to them). Florida was the default for a lot of retirees because of no state income tax, warm weather, and low cost of living, but those days are long gone with the residential insurance market collapsing, the price of real estate at all time highs, and the extreme shortage of doctors, RNs, CNAs, and care home aides. Similar to college costs, the amount of total capital required to retire comfortably is accelerating away (due to underlying cost inflation, compressed future capital market returns, and longer expected lifetimes) from the capability of the mean worker to accomplish the necessary level of wealth accumulation during a work lifetime. Very few levers to pull besides earning more or finding somewhere to live that costs less.
    - antisthenes 4y ago
      This is all perfectly fine. The wealthy years of the 20th century (driven by ludicrous amounts of fossil fuel exploitation) are an incredible anomaly in human history anyway. We're just reverting back to the mean when the vast majority of people never retired. It was good enough not to die of hunger. This is going to continue until we start decoupling more of the economy from fossil fuels.
      - klipklop 4y ago
        This is a super narrow pessimistic viewpoint that is rife with agenda pushing. We do not know if the wealthy years of the 20th century are over yet. Neo-feudalism is possible, but unlikely to be the same conditions as the middle-ages standard of work until you drop dead. Not every single problem in society is fixed by getting off fossil fuels. "Decoupling" the economy from fossil fuels will not be a magic solution in this case.
bbbobbb 4y ago
It's kind of wild to think about that these people are portrayed as living somewhat frugally (although so are the ones from the $2m article linked inside). Most people couldn't dream of accumulating that much money over their lifetime and would be considered crazy rich in most countries.

voisin 4y ago

Costs a lot to expatriate though. Deemed disposition on exit = capital gains.

toomuchtodo 4y ago

It’s already happening with retirees moving to Mexico, Portugal, and Southeast Asia. Agree you’ll see it pickup as more folks retire and can’t make ends meet in the US. Half of retirees over 55 have no retirement savings whatsoever, and will rely solely on Social Security income. https://www.cnbc.com/2022/11/02/retire-abroad-in-these-10-cities-for-less-than-2000-dollars-per-month.html https://www.cnbc.com/2022/11/02/retire-abroad-in-these-10-ci... https://www.aarp.org/retirement/retirement-savings/info-2019/no-retirement-money-saved.html https://www.aarp.org/retirement/retirement-savings/info-2019...

throwaway1777 4y ago
Don’t you lose social security if you move outside the us?
- toomuchtodo 4y ago
  You’re entitled to your Social Security benefits regardless of where you reside globally. You don’t have Medicare coverage outside of the US though. Typically, your Social Security is your passive/pension/monthly income that qualifies you for a long term retirement visa. A hack you can do if you can work remotely is collect Social Security out of the country while working remote; this increases your income and if your annual income replaces previous lower income years on your Social Security wage record, your monthly benefit will go up over time as the SSA re-evaluates your benefit annually (not to mention cost of living adjustments).
zeroonetwothree 4y ago
Is this new though? I don’t think people in the past saved much either
- toomuchtodo 4y ago
  It's a lengthy discussion topic to say the least. High level, pension coverage and associated healthcare plans have declined over the decades, 401ks (they were initially designed as a tax shelter for the wealthy) were parroted as the solution when they weren’t, and with the healthcare arrangement in the US, what might have been sustainable previously no longer is. Hence, people bouncing from an extraction economy to enjoy higher standard of living during the last chapter of their life (because it ain’t getting fixed in the US in a timeframe that matters to them). Florida was the default for a lot of retirees because of no state income tax, warm weather, and low cost of living, but those days are long gone with the residential insurance market collapsing, the price of real estate at all time highs, and the extreme shortage of doctors, RNs, CNAs, and care home aides. Similar to college costs, the amount of total capital required to retire comfortably is accelerating away (due to underlying cost inflation, compressed future capital market returns, and longer expected lifetimes) from the capability of the mean worker to accomplish the necessary level of wealth accumulation during a work lifetime. Very few levers to pull besides earning more or finding somewhere to live that costs less.
  - antisthenes 4y ago
    This is all perfectly fine. The wealthy years of the 20th century (driven by ludicrous amounts of fossil fuel exploitation) are an incredible anomaly in human history anyway. We're just reverting back to the mean when the vast majority of people never retired. It was good enough not to die of hunger. This is going to continue until we start decoupling more of the economy from fossil fuels.
    - klipklop 4y ago
      This is a super narrow pessimistic viewpoint that is rife with agenda pushing. We do not know if the wealthy years of the 20th century are over yet. Neo-feudalism is possible, but unlikely to be the same conditions as the middle-ages standard of work until you drop dead. Not every single problem in society is fixed by getting off fossil fuels. "Decoupling" the economy from fossil fuels will not be a magic solution in this case.

bbbobbb 4y ago

It's kind of wild to think about that these people are portrayed as living somewhat frugally (although so are the ones from the $2m article linked inside). Most people couldn't dream of accumulating that much money over their lifetime and would be considered crazy rich in most countries.