4 ms·

Profoundly sad that PCem ended up being abandoned while this hostile fork continues. It deserved a better fate.

jlundberg 4y ago
Curious to know more about this! Please elaborate on this if you don’t mind! :)
gattilorenz 4y ago
The “hostile fork” is the lively one that supports more hardware and has better GUI, so I’m not particularly sad about it, tbh.
- LocutusOfBorges 4y ago
  The way I’ve seen senior 86box project staff behave towards the developers of the project they forked away from really surprised me - a lot of emulator projects tend to be prone to silly rivalries, but this instance stuck me as unusually inappropriate behaviour - such were the levels of toxicity involved that at one point a senior staff member at 86box was bouncing around ideas mid-tirade speculating that a PCem contributor was in a sexual relationship with the project lead (put less delicately), this being drawn from the fact that they occasionally said good things about the project in public forums. The software is what it is, and for anyone who considers it to simply be a means to an end, it’s a fine tool to use. I just personally found that incident (among other examples of extraordinarily toxic, childish behaviour from other contributors) to be sufficiently distasteful that I’d rather just not use the software at all. This is are quite old sentiments on my part, and I expect things will probably have got a great deal better now, given how many years it’s been - it’s certainly not something that warrants calling for some kind of mob-facilitated cancellation of the project, which is, I must stress, a perfectly adequate PCem replacement under these circumstances. Strictly just a case of me as an individual wishing that interactions had been less toxic prior to the parent project’s discontinuation. I won’t use it because of those memories, having known one of the people concerned at the time. I don’t really think it’s something that should affect anyone else’s decision to use the program at all - it’s very much an individual distaste for it on my part.
  - gattilorenz 4y ago
    Thanks for the detailed elaboration! I’ve seen the “split” from a distance and never really investigated what has happened. Sounds pretty nasty indeed
    - rnd0 4y ago
      If you weren't there, you don't know the details or motivations of what went on it's probably a good idea to not take sides.
  - rnd0 4y ago
    >such were the levels of toxicity involved that at one point a senior staff member at 86box was bouncing around ideas mid-tirade speculating that a PCem contributor was in a sexual relationship with the project lead (put less delicately), this being drawn from the fact that they occasionally said good things about the project in public forums. I've been following this for 9 years now and this is the first I've heard of this. Literally. In short, I literally don't believe you -and considering that there was at least one hanger-on who used to kick up dust between the two projects in the name of "defending" 86box (but in reality was just acting out their own behavioral issues) I'd advise everyone to blow off personality-based issues like this. > I don’t really think it’s something that should affect anyone else’s decision to use the program at all - it’s very much an individual distaste for it on my part. Obviously you do think it is or you would not have posted a huge long allegations-filled screed (filled with dubious allegations of a sexual affair) on the subject. The 86Box lead has expressed regret for his early behavoirs many, many times but sadly the emulator scene attracts a lot of drama and worse people who thrive off of drama. The 86Box project itself, however, is one of the better handled non-professional (meaning not run by a corporation) that I'm aware of. And the software itself has gotten better and better over the years. I'd strongly advise everyone reading about 86box just in general to be particularly aware that just because you read a claim on the internet doesn't make it the lords' gospel truth.
rnd0 4y ago
PCem is still being developed, though. 86Box has done a lot of improvements on the codebase over the last 5 years and has developed its' own community; meanwhile pcem got bogged down in drama and stagnated. I followed pcem and saw enough toxicity there that I am unsurprised by how things have played out. But 86box has earned it's current place by putting in the time, works, research into it's development as well as continually working on being a less toxic (this is the internet -it's all toxic) environment.

Curious to know more about this! Please elaborate on this if you don’t mind! :)

The “hostile fork” is the lively one that supports more hardware and has better GUI, so I’m not particularly sad about it, tbh.

LocutusOfBorges 4y ago
The way I’ve seen senior 86box project staff behave towards the developers of the project they forked away from really surprised me - a lot of emulator projects tend to be prone to silly rivalries, but this instance stuck me as unusually inappropriate behaviour - such were the levels of toxicity involved that at one point a senior staff member at 86box was bouncing around ideas mid-tirade speculating that a PCem contributor was in a sexual relationship with the project lead (put less delicately), this being drawn from the fact that they occasionally said good things about the project in public forums. The software is what it is, and for anyone who considers it to simply be a means to an end, it’s a fine tool to use. I just personally found that incident (among other examples of extraordinarily toxic, childish behaviour from other contributors) to be sufficiently distasteful that I’d rather just not use the software at all. This is are quite old sentiments on my part, and I expect things will probably have got a great deal better now, given how many years it’s been - it’s certainly not something that warrants calling for some kind of mob-facilitated cancellation of the project, which is, I must stress, a perfectly adequate PCem replacement under these circumstances. Strictly just a case of me as an individual wishing that interactions had been less toxic prior to the parent project’s discontinuation. I won’t use it because of those memories, having known one of the people concerned at the time. I don’t really think it’s something that should affect anyone else’s decision to use the program at all - it’s very much an individual distaste for it on my part.
- gattilorenz 4y ago
  Thanks for the detailed elaboration! I’ve seen the “split” from a distance and never really investigated what has happened. Sounds pretty nasty indeed
  - rnd0 4y ago
    If you weren't there, you don't know the details or motivations of what went on it's probably a good idea to not take sides.
- rnd0 4y ago
  >such were the levels of toxicity involved that at one point a senior staff member at 86box was bouncing around ideas mid-tirade speculating that a PCem contributor was in a sexual relationship with the project lead (put less delicately), this being drawn from the fact that they occasionally said good things about the project in public forums. I've been following this for 9 years now and this is the first I've heard of this. Literally. In short, I literally don't believe you -and considering that there was at least one hanger-on who used to kick up dust between the two projects in the name of "defending" 86box (but in reality was just acting out their own behavioral issues) I'd advise everyone to blow off personality-based issues like this. > I don’t really think it’s something that should affect anyone else’s decision to use the program at all - it’s very much an individual distaste for it on my part. Obviously you do think it is or you would not have posted a huge long allegations-filled screed (filled with dubious allegations of a sexual affair) on the subject. The 86Box lead has expressed regret for his early behavoirs many, many times but sadly the emulator scene attracts a lot of drama and worse people who thrive off of drama. The 86Box project itself, however, is one of the better handled non-professional (meaning not run by a corporation) that I'm aware of. And the software itself has gotten better and better over the years. I'd strongly advise everyone reading about 86box just in general to be particularly aware that just because you read a claim on the internet doesn't make it the lords' gospel truth.

rnd0 4y ago

PCem is still being developed, though. 86Box has done a lot of improvements on the codebase over the last 5 years and has developed its' own community; meanwhile pcem got bogged down in drama and stagnated. I followed pcem and saw enough toxicity there that I am unsurprised by how things have played out. But 86box has earned it's current place by putting in the time, works, research into it's development as well as continually working on being a less toxic (this is the internet -it's all toxic) environment.