7 ms·

Are You Really Losing Weight?

45 points by alexmolas 4y ago

yodon 4y ago
This feels like the stack-exchange math-nerd's fitness version of "I wanted to be more productive so I spent 1000 hours writing this weird TODO app."
- BuyMyBitcoins 4y ago
  All that typing and mental effort must have burned some calories.
generj 4y ago
This is important because most people “losing weight” have made one change to their diet and exercise program while simultaneously eating more or otherwise cheating. However it feels like they are more healthy, and the trend line seems to agree. (Often they are much healthier, just not changing weight but redistributing it, but measuring that is far harder). People eventually get jaded of the false progress cycle and give up on weight loss because it feels impossible. An app implementing this system would be of great help.
- nvahalik 4y ago
  > People eventually get jaded of the false progress cycle Most people just don't want to do the work. Changing a lifelong eating habit is hard. Moving from a sedentary lifestyle to a more active lifestyle is hard. There are ups and downs and overall the progression is definitely more of a journey than just an overnight thing. We live in a therapeutic culture which just wants to address things with a pill or with a surgery. Actually admitting that your lifestyle sucks and that it must change is not something we a society have embraced much in the last few decades.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
tantalor 4y ago
> throw away all of the results which showed an increase in weight Huh?
- gannon___ 4y ago
  ^ core assumption of this article is that people weigh themselves multiple times a day, and only keep the minimum weight. Maybe this is the case in the first few days, but I’d be surprised to hear most people weigh themselves _many_ times a day.
  - autotune 4y ago
    I have been doing this in order to learn how much weight I immediately gain after a meal to actually learn how what I eat results in weight changes. Like eating 6 "meatless" chicken nuggets vs a slice or two of pizza and adjust accordingly to meet my daily target weight for the end of the night right before bed for healthy weight loss on a weekly basis. Portion sizes in the USA are so far different from reality that what you think is "one serving" is actually 2-3+ for a given meal, and I have had to completely rethink what a "healthy" portion size actually looks like for breakfast, lunch, and dinner.
    - sand500 4y ago
      Pretty sure the dominant factor here is salt content and thus water retention.
      - autotune 4y ago
        You could also frame it as a protein vs carbs argument and which one fills you up more with less overall calories after a given meal.
        lupire 4y ago
        But fiber and water fill you up too.
theCrowing 4y ago
Isn't that exactly why most modern scales are calculating your body fat?
- yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago
  They do what now? How does that work?
  - Ygg2 4y ago
    Yes. They measure electric resistance of your body to determine fat vs muscle ratio.
    - Sunspark 4y ago
      I am skeptical anyone needs this. If you have love handles that can be pinched, you already know where you are.
      - dhosek 4y ago
        But being able to measure changes in the pinchable love handles is not so simple. After all, getting regular feedback on whether a change is making a difference can be an incentive to maintain that change.
        wyre 4y ago
        Using a cloth measuring tape and a mirror for reference gives plenty of feedback. Bf% from a scale is going to be so inconsistent I could only think it would be useful over a large timeframe to notice trends, which at that point your jeans are too big.
        dhosek 4y ago
        Are you basing this on actual experience or just your belief?
  - 4y ago
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
zeroonetwothree 4y ago
The premise of this makes no sense. Who is actually doing this process?
mastry 4y ago
[flagged]
- michaericalribo 4y ago
  I agree. Phrased slightly differently: It’s a pity this post is fat shaming, because it _is_ a distraction from an otherwise interesting post. Intentional or not, it unnecessarily gets in a dirty jab that cuts deep.
- AdrianB1 4y ago
  I see myself this way, partly. I have "normal" weight from spring to autumn (by BMI), but then I gain 5 kg every winter by Christmas. Why is that? Because I am a lazy shit and I stop cycling in November, when the weather is no longer appropriate, and I eat about the same as when I do several hours of intense cycling per week on top of the round the year other physical activity. My BMI gets too close to "overweight" because of that. Am I lazy, not doing something else instead of cycling? Definitely. Do I deserve to be ridiculed? Yes, I think I deserve it. Is this the same for everyone? Well, "everyone" is too wide, but for "most people", yes.
  - JumpCrisscross 4y ago
    > Is this the same for everyone? Well, "everyone" is too wide, but for "most people", yes This is a good balance. There are folks with metabolic issues. But there are many, too, eating butter-boiled pork chops twice a week while taking Uber two blocks. One was a good friend, and simply saying “this is who you are” is reductive and selfish.
  - Zababa 4y ago
    Being ridiculed doesn't push me into action and just makes me feel worse, which tends to make me overeat more to cope. Different solutions work for différent people. Some dogs only react to positive reinforcement, others only to negative reinforcement. If ridicule is fuel for you that's great, and I hope you can find a source to use it and end up with a weight that you feel better about. But be careful when using that with others, please.
bawolff 4y ago
What actually is the standard deviation of the weight of a normal healthy adult human (not actively trying to lose weight)? I kind of assumed it was fairly low.
- AdrianB1 4y ago
  Not sure, but mine is changing by ~ 6% every year for the past 10 years, by seasons (yearly cycle). I started to consider this "normal".
- tootie 4y ago
  Things like water retention and how much food is in your gut can cause variance throughout the day. If you weigh yourself at a consistent time of day and consistent with bowel movements it should be pretty steady.
  - Zababa 4y ago
    Add to that: if you do it in the morning try to have consistent sleep cycle, and make a "once and for all" decision for stuff like should you pee before, should you drink/take a shower before. Lots of things can influence your weight. My scale will also give a few different results for reasons I ignore, try to weigh yourself a few time to see if that's the case and choose what to take (always the highest/lowest? Average? Median?)
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
graeme 4y ago
Weight is a poor metric to track in isolation, prone to error. Much more robust to also track waist circumference. There is actually a neat formula called the navy formula to estimate body fat and lean mass from four variables for men and five for women. For men: waist circumference, weight, neck circumference, height. Women should also add hip circumference. There are calculators online, but for anyone interested I expressed the formula into this Shortcut for Apple devices. You enter your height (do this once, in the blank text field above height) Then, measure your neck circumference and remember it. This won’t change much. I measure mine maybe once every 1-2 months or if my other measures changed significantly. Then, whenever you would normally weigh yourself, measure your waist too. Then enter weight + waist + neck circumference. The Shortcut will then calculate the following and log to Apple Health: * Weight * Waist circumference * BMI * Estimated lean mass * Estimated body fat The last two obviously have an error, but it will be a fairly consistent error so the trend over time will be clear. For instance recently I gained a bit of weight. But my waist circumference went down a little. So my weight increase is actually muscle, and I’m going in the right direction. Shortcut is here: https://www.icloud.com/shortcuts/1be74cce1ac24c03821feb7e36d47e45 https://www.icloud.com/shortcuts/1be74cce1ac24c03821feb7e36d... Don’t have a woman’s version unfortunately, made this for my own use. If there’s interest I could probably create a version that includes hip circumference
- AnonHP 4y ago
  Does this assume specific units for the measurements of weight and circumference? If yes, what are those and how would one change the formulas for other units of measurement?
  - graeme 4y ago
    Oh right, this one is inches and pounds. You would change it by going into the shortcut and entering different conversion figures based on the formula in metric instead
- anothernewdude 4y ago
  Navy Formula calls me an athlete and is SORELY mistaken. BMI accurately calls me overweight, but is probably mistaken about how much.
adamgordonbell 4y ago
Check out trendweight. With a smart scale it's been awesome. It tries to show you a moving average as your true weight and not emphasize the actual day to day weight. http://trendweight.com http://trendweight.com
andreareina 4y ago
No, your real weight does not fluctuate around a mean with a standard deviation. For one thing, your weight today has a great deal to do with your weight yesterday. This alone means you shouldn’t expect the kind of graph in TFA if your weight is in fact stable.
IanCal 4y ago
Quite surprised at how people are reading a little mathematical exercise as anything to do with either weight loss or what people are doing in reality.

45 points by alexmolas 4y ago

This feels like the stack-exchange math-nerd's fitness version of "I wanted to be more productive so I spent 1000 hours writing this weird TODO app."

BuyMyBitcoins 4y ago
All that typing and mental effort must have burned some calories.

generj 4y ago

This is important because most people “losing weight” have made one change to their diet and exercise program while simultaneously eating more or otherwise cheating. However it feels like they are more healthy, and the trend line seems to agree. (Often they are much healthier, just not changing weight but redistributing it, but measuring that is far harder). People eventually get jaded of the false progress cycle and give up on weight loss because it feels impossible. An app implementing this system would be of great help.

nvahalik 4y ago
> People eventually get jaded of the false progress cycle Most people just don't want to do the work. Changing a lifelong eating habit is hard. Moving from a sedentary lifestyle to a more active lifestyle is hard. There are ups and downs and overall the progression is definitely more of a journey than just an overnight thing. We live in a therapeutic culture which just wants to address things with a pill or with a surgery. Actually admitting that your lifestyle sucks and that it must change is not something we a society have embraced much in the last few decades.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]

tantalor 4y ago

> throw away all of the results which showed an increase in weight Huh?

gannon___ 4y ago
^ core assumption of this article is that people weigh themselves multiple times a day, and only keep the minimum weight. Maybe this is the case in the first few days, but I’d be surprised to hear most people weigh themselves _many_ times a day.
- autotune 4y ago
  I have been doing this in order to learn how much weight I immediately gain after a meal to actually learn how what I eat results in weight changes. Like eating 6 "meatless" chicken nuggets vs a slice or two of pizza and adjust accordingly to meet my daily target weight for the end of the night right before bed for healthy weight loss on a weekly basis. Portion sizes in the USA are so far different from reality that what you think is "one serving" is actually 2-3+ for a given meal, and I have had to completely rethink what a "healthy" portion size actually looks like for breakfast, lunch, and dinner.
  - sand500 4y ago
    Pretty sure the dominant factor here is salt content and thus water retention.
    - autotune 4y ago
      You could also frame it as a protein vs carbs argument and which one fills you up more with less overall calories after a given meal.
      - lupire 4y ago
        But fiber and water fill you up too.

theCrowing 4y ago

Isn't that exactly why most modern scales are calculating your body fat?

yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago
They do what now? How does that work?
- Ygg2 4y ago
  Yes. They measure electric resistance of your body to determine fat vs muscle ratio.
  - Sunspark 4y ago
    I am skeptical anyone needs this. If you have love handles that can be pinched, you already know where you are.
    - dhosek 4y ago
      But being able to measure changes in the pinchable love handles is not so simple. After all, getting regular feedback on whether a change is making a difference can be an incentive to maintain that change.
      - wyre 4y ago
        Using a cloth measuring tape and a mirror for reference gives plenty of feedback. Bf% from a scale is going to be so inconsistent I could only think it would be useful over a large timeframe to notice trends, which at that point your jeans are too big.
        dhosek 4y ago
        Are you basing this on actual experience or just your belief?
- 4y ago

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

zeroonetwothree 4y ago

The premise of this makes no sense. Who is actually doing this process?

mastry 4y ago

[flagged]

michaericalribo 4y ago
I agree. Phrased slightly differently: It’s a pity this post is fat shaming, because it _is_ a distraction from an otherwise interesting post. Intentional or not, it unnecessarily gets in a dirty jab that cuts deep.
AdrianB1 4y ago
I see myself this way, partly. I have "normal" weight from spring to autumn (by BMI), but then I gain 5 kg every winter by Christmas. Why is that? Because I am a lazy shit and I stop cycling in November, when the weather is no longer appropriate, and I eat about the same as when I do several hours of intense cycling per week on top of the round the year other physical activity. My BMI gets too close to "overweight" because of that. Am I lazy, not doing something else instead of cycling? Definitely. Do I deserve to be ridiculed? Yes, I think I deserve it. Is this the same for everyone? Well, "everyone" is too wide, but for "most people", yes.
- JumpCrisscross 4y ago
  > Is this the same for everyone? Well, "everyone" is too wide, but for "most people", yes This is a good balance. There are folks with metabolic issues. But there are many, too, eating butter-boiled pork chops twice a week while taking Uber two blocks. One was a good friend, and simply saying “this is who you are” is reductive and selfish.
- Zababa 4y ago
  Being ridiculed doesn't push me into action and just makes me feel worse, which tends to make me overeat more to cope. Different solutions work for différent people. Some dogs only react to positive reinforcement, others only to negative reinforcement. If ridicule is fuel for you that's great, and I hope you can find a source to use it and end up with a weight that you feel better about. But be careful when using that with others, please.

bawolff 4y ago

What actually is the standard deviation of the weight of a normal healthy adult human (not actively trying to lose weight)? I kind of assumed it was fairly low.

AdrianB1 4y ago
Not sure, but mine is changing by ~ 6% every year for the past 10 years, by seasons (yearly cycle). I started to consider this "normal".
tootie 4y ago
Things like water retention and how much food is in your gut can cause variance throughout the day. If you weigh yourself at a consistent time of day and consistent with bowel movements it should be pretty steady.
- Zababa 4y ago
  Add to that: if you do it in the morning try to have consistent sleep cycle, and make a "once and for all" decision for stuff like should you pee before, should you drink/take a shower before. Lots of things can influence your weight. My scale will also give a few different results for reasons I ignore, try to weigh yourself a few time to see if that's the case and choose what to take (always the highest/lowest? Average? Median?)
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

graeme 4y ago

Weight is a poor metric to track in isolation, prone to error. Much more robust to also track waist circumference. There is actually a neat formula called the navy formula to estimate body fat and lean mass from four variables for men and five for women. For men: waist circumference, weight, neck circumference, height. Women should also add hip circumference. There are calculators online, but for anyone interested I expressed the formula into this Shortcut for Apple devices. You enter your height (do this once, in the blank text field above height) Then, measure your neck circumference and remember it. This won’t change much. I measure mine maybe once every 1-2 months or if my other measures changed significantly. Then, whenever you would normally weigh yourself, measure your waist too. Then enter weight + waist + neck circumference. The Shortcut will then calculate the following and log to Apple Health: * Weight * Waist circumference * BMI * Estimated lean mass * Estimated body fat The last two obviously have an error, but it will be a fairly consistent error so the trend over time will be clear. For instance recently I gained a bit of weight. But my waist circumference went down a little. So my weight increase is actually muscle, and I’m going in the right direction. Shortcut is here: https://www.icloud.com/shortcuts/1be74cce1ac24c03821feb7e36d47e45 https://www.icloud.com/shortcuts/1be74cce1ac24c03821feb7e36d... Don’t have a woman’s version unfortunately, made this for my own use. If there’s interest I could probably create a version that includes hip circumference

AnonHP 4y ago
Does this assume specific units for the measurements of weight and circumference? If yes, what are those and how would one change the formulas for other units of measurement?
- graeme 4y ago
  Oh right, this one is inches and pounds. You would change it by going into the shortcut and entering different conversion figures based on the formula in metric instead
anothernewdude 4y ago
Navy Formula calls me an athlete and is SORELY mistaken. BMI accurately calls me overweight, but is probably mistaken about how much.

adamgordonbell 4y ago

Check out trendweight. With a smart scale it's been awesome. It tries to show you a moving average as your true weight and not emphasize the actual day to day weight. http://trendweight.com http://trendweight.com

andreareina 4y ago

No, your real weight does not fluctuate around a mean with a standard deviation. For one thing, your weight today has a great deal to do with your weight yesterday. This alone means you shouldn’t expect the kind of graph in TFA if your weight is in fact stable.

IanCal 4y ago

Quite surprised at how people are reading a little mathematical exercise as anything to do with either weight loss or what people are doing in reality.